Daysofgame said:

An active conversation with men with real experience on truly advanced topics would move all of us fwd… deepen the practical renaissance of sex/relationship mastery.

You can’t get better at tennis if you only play against newbs.  So ya, more people joining in from a first person current lived perspective at more advanced levels brings us all to better form.

You’re perfect to have in the conversation about advanced relationship skills because three things:

  • your breadth of study
  • your willingness to tease out the wheat from the chaffe in what anyone says, plus your ability to translate between different frames of reference and metaphors and ways of thinking
  • your Dale Carnegy high end skills of diplomacy.

An intern once asked me to teach him about Chi-Kung. I gave him an overview and a few lessons, and he went off on his own from there. In my understanding, there is no ultimate true method; you grow the phantom limbs that you choose to pay attention on growing. The framework that we grow on is very very loose. I don’t teach much of the traditional things, such as red on the outside white on the inside left side channel beside the central channel beside the white on the outside red on the inside right side channel. That channel is not a discovery of something real, it’s a creation of something that becomes real.

So anyway, within a brief period of some months, he was having very strong Chi-Kung and Qi-kong sex experiences. Very different from my own.

So if we get a community of guys talking about advanced stuff, we aren’t going to be agreeing on where is the right-hand channel and what color it is. But some underlying patterns might still be discernible.

The way that someones heart-chakra energy opens will be experienced uniquely for everyone. But love is an underlying pattern we will be able to notice. And we can consider the different frames of reference and viewpoints on love as real different worlds, seeing reality. The fun task isn’t to see the same reality, it’s to see the breadth and profundity. More info at once, and better integration of the massively parallel insights and embodied wisdom that are not surface.

My best guess (in part, as I’m doing this when I am “blowing girls minds”) is you are “bringing more and more energy through the girl.” This is “fucking her open to god.”

To quote myself: “You have to feel a lot in order for the girl to feel a lot”

I like the way you put it too. We all know that the more sexually responsive a girl is, the more fun she is to be with. Funny how guys never talk about that about themselves.

Children from a young age learn to sex differentiate. Part of it is innate; boys stop joining in on playing with dolls with the girls and get more interested in the Tonka Trucks. Part of it is just noticing what each group is doing. So I don’t know how much it’s cultural sex differentiation that keeps guys from talking out loud that they will be WAY way way better in bed if they FEEL more and are more sexually responsive.

Or maybe it’s because most guys are struggling to feel less, because it’s too easy to orgasm.

That’s where chi-kung comes in, of course. It increases no only your libido, but your control. You can hold MUCH more energy. It can be so intense as to be indistinguishable from pain.

I remember going to the dentist during a period when my sex was usually extremely intense. The dentist pain became the same as the sex pain for me – indistinguishable from pleasure.

That’s just one manifestation of high energy though. There are many other ways. Again, why chi-kung helps; to find many voices, to find many embodiments. And why formless meditation helps. To not need any dreams or embodiments at all, but to just let aliveness be simple. To appreciate the appreciation, and let it broaden in a non-local way.

Daysofgame said:

I am waking up to this. As I learn more, and the “matrix” slows down, I can change the course of events in real time… so “shaping her” is becoming more common for me.

What happens for me seems to be the reverse. I might look back at what I just said and note with some surprise how appropriate it is.

Actually, no, you’re right. There is awareness in that split second improv moment, and we are aware of what micro-split second decisions we are making as we riff.

This is very similar to improv on a musical instrument. I wrote a post about that, that referenced a study of jazz improvizationalists that showed that the usual analytical decision making process gets shut down during improv. I think we get more right brained, and the flow moment puts us both more into the moment yet at once less in “decision making mode”

So maybe it’s the analytical part of my mind that sometimes looks back and is surprised at what I’ve just said.

Because there is no time for the analytical part to make such choices. The other way to think is massively-multi-parallel. You can’t be analytical and fast on your feet like that. There is no time for it.

Lately I’ve been talking a lot about improv and moving into right brained artistic ways of being, as well as muscle memory from reference experiences.

I think we also need to talk about feeling love and lusty appreciation as habit. I’ve been chewing on that idea these last few days, waiting to be ready to write about it.

Together they add up to all at once a mixture of:

  • being into the girl
  • showing it
  • leaning back instead of leaning in, as Riv would remind
  • constantly joking and using her micro-shit tests as fun starting points for agree-and amplify, or role play or changing the subject in a funny way, or simply agreeing, or ignoring,  or banter and so on.  Her shit tests can be more than defused and disarmed, they become fun and nourishing play.  Another ritual of devotion, a ritual of improv that makes her laugh.
  • filling the room with lusty paternal love that lights her up as if it’s opium in the air.
  • a constant feeling of sexual addiction and lust; constant sexual flirting
  • a feeling of long standing ease and closeness, as if you could have a conversation with your lips touching. You don’t have to move away from the fridge as she’s reaching in, she’ll appreciate you just being obstinately in the way as she sidles up right against you, as if you share the same body, you are so comfortable and familiar.

So ya, time slows down and you direct her attention and who she is, constantly, but also it’s a matter of habit, but habit of improv.

Always fresh, always new, yet always of a very familiar theme.

Being into each other and celebration.

Such a type of relationship is highly archetypal, by the way. If you act like this on the first date, the woman will fall straight into it, in mutual role play. She will feel as if the two of you have been in a great relationship for a long time.

It’s a kind of secret society. That even virgins can join. It’s just archetypal and easy. First date sex, and first date openness and coupling.

D said:

And I created someone who could be loved. The other part was recognizing the same potential in the people around me.

That’s a big deal.

I used to live in a monastery with Pema Chodron as the Abbess and my meditation instructor. She’s famous for teaching about Maitri, or self acceptance and love.

It’s a rather huge foundational part of all Buddhist practice, without which one can’t deepen and grow it into compassion.

Or the simple common sense notion that you can’t love others until you love yourself.

And no girl will love you for long if you don’t love her. Falling in love is something people prefer to do together.

So ya, keeping that warm sweet fire of self love in your heart is foundational to being loved.

To be as literal as possible… you’re making the experience of being with you, so intense, that she is “on drugs” when she feels that, it “changes her,” and she expects to be in a devotional state around you… and she has evidence… as you continue to use her as a vessel to concentrate “intense feelings.”

Yes, and not just intense feelings.

You feel good. You feel good around her. You like, love, lust, and appreciate her.

So you celebrate the energy-baby that is the love that the two of you create. You both feel that love as a real thing. It’s in the room, and you both deeply respect that baby. You both nurture it, constantly.

That baby needs sex, comfort, delicious food, quiet time apart, and on and on. It needs strong passionate sex, time with her listening to you play your muscial instrument or watching you be above average at the gym, or whatever it is that feeds the baby.

She’s going to be constantly saying “I love you”, because you are constantly, quietly, feeling love.

Her mirror neurons will pick up on your very subtle body language that you are unconscious of. All you have to do is be into her, (and 1000 other things that are already natural habit) and she’ll associate all her good feelings with you, and be constantly addicted.

She’ll miss you while doing the groceries, or if you step out to the gym. Even if you live together 24/7, she’ll not only never tire of you, but might burn with love so strong that it physically hurts her in the chest.

My girl dreams of me every single night. Unfortunately I’m often cheating in her dreams, or about to. That’s my karma, I suppose. That must be in my body language. But it’s also just because of the love-existential-angst.

Patrice talks about “karate school.” Saying she “learns your moves” and eventually you have to let her go and start over. This is “betatization” sort of, but staying one step ahead of her “chipping away,” and when she is too good… push her out.

And you are saying almost what Deida says. He says, in the end… women always win.

This hasn’t been my experience. However girls will leave a guy, eventually, who won’t commit in the way she wants. Marriage with monogamy is a common line in the sand that a woman is waiting for.

Blackdragon and others contest this point, and say that many women will hang around for years as fuck buddies.

That’s apples and oranges.

Women who are deeply in love with you and already pair bonded have expectations – biological expectations. It’s called having a baby.

Killyouregotowin said:

“Devotion… Fuck you! Devotion… Fuck you!” This is something that I believe even a “Top Guy” will have to deal with. I noticed that as I climb higher in life, her expectations of me climb as well. Briffault’s law doesn’t even begin to do justice on just how audacious female entitlement is. When you are a drunk captain, she will low level nag on a constant basis, but when you are making serious gains on a consistent basis, the slightest mistake will bring out a tantrum of worried insecurity based on her fear of you veering off course.

Been there, done that. Never again. I’ve had healthy win-win relationships in my recent and medium term past, and am in one currently, that look nothing like that.

With J she started to get cunty consistently, and even though we were living together I soft nexted her. No way in hell am I ever going to live that way again. I stopped eating for 3 days, and for the next two months without fail ate only every second day, which was on gym days. I upped my game, and demanded better treatment. That turned things around, and she never dared be cunty again. When she slides a bit, I let her know, and she fears my wrath. My wrath can be very gentle now; she listens and corrects.

But I could not have done that with a personality disordered passive aggressive or low self-awareness girl.

Not all girls are like that, and either it’s your fault, or hers, or both.

You don’t have to live like that.

Oh, and of course I still usually only eat every second day, and still maintain the gym regimen, and do everything else I can think of to remain extremely sexually competitive and her best option.

Both people have to work fucking hard to maintain strong passionate loving healthy win-win on the same team relationship, feeding the mutual baby of love.

And it’s up to you to make sure she works fucking hard. If you are working fucking hard at it, and she won’t or can’t, you have to move on. For her sake and yours. That’s what I think. Nobody can win with the personality disordered, and if you are walking on eggshells, while at the same time properly handling your shit and her shit tests, it’s on her.