Why I never say “I love you too”

In response to Riv’s post that mentioned the quandary of what to respond when a girl says “I love you”, I came up with:

It’s interesting to play with past and possible future scenarios with images and words. I tend to not do that much, if at all. I prefer to be forced on the spot to be enmeshed in the moment, and I have great trust that the moment will produce an appropriate response.

However I also do put a great deal of contemplation and theoretical framework as supports for what could come out in the moment. Sort of like piano, again. The more compositions and musical theory you study, the more variety of spontaneous improvisations you’ll be capable of.

But I do hold as a strong value that improv is the whole point; not winning an appropriate response out of the girl. I mean, it could be winning the battle but losing the war, if every interaction is bogged down in left brained analysis. A big part of the fun is in letting the right brain do it’s thing; in trusting that it will be authentic and smart and open and honest and clever and real, and engage in a way that gives encouragement, fun, discipline, warmth, joy. Trust in the dreamer to be able to dream and go with him; he’s been there for you before, he’ll be there for you again.

I once tried to think this through in a blog post titled improv as the foundation of game.

I think there is really something to be said for improv. I was a student of the students of Trungpa Rinpoche, and one of his students was Alen Ginsberg. Trungpa R would instruct Ginsberg and many of his students to get up on stage in front of crowds and do spontaneous poetry. So Ginberg told us of this history as an introduction to a spontaneous poem. I was blown away. Not only by his ease and confidence, but by the quality of the poem.

I’ve spent time in poetry writing classes, and a few years as a hobbyist poet. It can take weeks to craft and edit a great poem.

Comedians also speak sometimes to how much extra spark you get, in the moment. It’s a real crucible for the very best to come out. And song writers talk of their session jams with literal reverance. There is something about the state of mind of improv, where you rely on the flow moment, in the moment, enmeshed in the very subtle responsive cues from your mind and music and voice the crowd. Waiting until the very last microsecond to respond to the very next microsecond.

It’s a totally different game than thinking “what should I have said or done”.

It’s a different state of being, and it’s the state of being itself that is the medium, which is the message.

J tells me loves me as if trying to ease a constant burning ache. Probably more than 100 times a day. Sometimes she asks me if I love her. I usually say nothing at all, rarely I’ll say don’t ask me that, and sometimes spontaneously and unexpected I’ll tell her that I love her. I never do it on demand, and I never “say it back”. That feels highly unnatural to me. Yes, she wants reassurance. No, I can’t possibly give it to her. She’s insecure, and that’s normal and natural, and she’ll just have to live with the pain of being in love. We all do, and it’s fine.


In other news, J has a former western boyfriend who has gone of the deep end and is stalking her. He told her family that they were already married, and the shock of it I’m told contributed to her grandmother having a stroke. Her grandmother is not able to speak now. The guy is claiming he’ll come to where she lives and do something nefarious. There might be violence.

In other news, random acts of violence from SE-Asians towards Westerners are still on the increase, and unfortunately this cultural disease seems to be spreading to new areas. The horror stories are bad. I’m of the opinion that the root cause is jealousy and cultural mate guarding. Westerners often hang cute young things on their arm, and are on the whole financially and otherwise better endowed, and locals boil under the collar until random acts of violence occur. The police will be of no help in these matters, and can actually make things worse.

The same old mantra is being repeated more and more, and it’s getting more and more blatant and in your face “where do you think you are?”. Try to just stand up for yourself against random abuse, and you could be on the wrong end of a group beating.

There is also growing mafia presence in some areas that is wiping out tourism. Heartbreaking to see. Crime and violence mixed with corruption and devastating racism. It’s horrific and sad.

Update: One could think of the Bali bombings through the lens of jealousy and cultural mate guarding.  I recall being told that the Muslim bombers were against disco life, as it was decadently not about virginity and monogamy and sobriety.  But there are plenty of targets in Indonesia where mostly only Indonesians get drunk and do drugs and fuck each other like rabbits.  Was it a coincidence that it was the interlopers who got their heads and arms blown off?

Update: When I awoke I felt unsure about this post that I’d written the night before. Was I just trying to brag, or did I have something useful to say? I felt queasy about the idea of even hinting that playing fun games like “What would you do if” was somehow not optimal.  Was I trying to advocate “just be yourself game”?

Then I reread it, and I think there is something in there. Somewhere. Something about improv is a subject worth looking deeper into.

I still feel queasy though, because the human mind is quite tricky; it’s more segmented than we usually realize. Language is tricky. The analytical mind is not exactly in the right hemisphere, and our minds aren’t exactly divided, yet it is fair to say that sometimes even the most brilliant analysis is still a small part of a bigger picture that our overall mind puts together, in the background, without our knowing effort. What would you do if is a great game to play, and helps with our future spontaneity. Looking directly at flow moments and spontaneity as a deliberate goal is quite interesting.


If you read this you will feel Christmas in your heart.

The middle aged handsome woman walked up the stairs, and there was immediate sunshine. She made me feel as if this was completely normal, and was warm, fun and funny, and at smiling ease, as if she knew that I already felt exactly like this. She introduced herself with a twinkling hello, and noticing all the instruments joked that I’ve made the room into a music studio. Her assumption of immediate rapport made it so.

Later in the day I interrupted the man at the gym, and told him that he was the biggest man that I’ve ever seen, and that I was curious as to how much food did he eat every day. Seven Chickens? Very close, he said. I need to eat 8 meals every day. I was struck by how much attention he kept trying to focus on me, being attentive and interesting in my life, as if he was David Bowie and not taking any of this hero worship bullshit and wanted to engage and learn something. Humbling. It made me realize that I’m deficient at paying attention to others, and so I tried to snap out of it, and ask him about himself. Turns out that he is a professional bodybuilder, and that he makes his living this way. His girlfriend at the gym was not only way above average in attractiveness, but her voice was calm yet full of fun. A well rounded yet excitable personality, and hot. A good pair, and they are more than happy with the pairing, they are calmed the fuck down. I’ve only learned about that option recently.

After the gym, I went out to see how attractive I was. Because my girl keeps telling me stories about ever since I’ve convinced her to wear form fitting dresses onto her tiny little 12 year old looking uber slim figure, she’s a constant magnet for guys hitting on her.

I love that. But I’d not feel at my best if it was one sided. So I tested it.

And I got the results that I wanted. Two 17 to 19 year old super hotties and me exchanged holy fuck I’m interested in you long stares and big smiles. Which grew all around between us openly squirmy and fully unabashedly wide after an overt hello wave and “Hi!” voice. I could have sat down at their table. I’m not talking about one girl, I’m talking about two. Two as in two.

So that counts. Then I came home, and explained all this in detail to my “wife”. That it’s fair and good that we both have options. She explained that she puts everything she has – all her love and devotion and attention – into me. And I told her that I respect her voodoo. That I’m different now, and I have no idea why. She’s doing a good job. I’m calmed down.

Later I did a magic power on her. I don’t talk about my magic powers on my blog. I don’t talk about my magic powers to my girls. It’s been said that a man should display value. But I keep some talents hidden, yet pull them out sometimes. Like in that episode of Taxi where the stoner suddenly played perfect piano, then a moment later had no recollection that he could do it.

I have some literal magical powers, if you choose to look at them from a metaphysical point of view. Usually I choose to look at them from a hypnotic point of view, however sometimes more information that is coherent with the facts is conveyed by a more metaphysical view. Neither views are complete. Neither are correct. I don’t claim to know what is reality. But I do claim to know that I can at will put people to sleep by touching them.

And that I was taught this, and that it’s a thing. A teachable thing.

As a student you are taught to try to maintain awareness as the teacher does healing touch on you. You get better at it. Like lucid dreaming.

I’ll leave it here.

Love is as real as you want it to be. You could have spiritual powers, if you were interested.

Sometimes people are stressed and not at their mentally best; maybe they feel insecure in a moment, and so choose emotional paths of “logic” that are actually political paths of agreement with a group in order to get hoped for group benefits.

But think about Joe Rogan for a moment. A man who is not even a mid-wit. He’s an ordinary bloke, with tons of wrong ideas, but he’s a good listener.

It’s not always about hardware. Software changes won’t make you the biggest guy in the gym, but you can be decent. You don’t have to be the smartest, and it’s not always the most attractive to be the biggest or smartest. But you can be that sunshine walking up the stairs. Slowly, step by step, you can.

Oh ya, one guy I really admire is Daysofgame, not because he’s Joe Rogan humble and so has a good reason to be a good listener, but because he’s smart enough to not have to listen, yet is an incredibly good listener.

Way better listener than I am. I’m too involved in my own wonderful and very engaging genius to have learned how to properly engage with people who don’t smell like women. It’s not game over, and I’m getting better, but Nash is one of many inspirations of men who listen and learn.

There are more – I’ve been focusing so hard on breaking wrong views that I’ve neglected the healthy and varied respectable men.

Oh, that reminds me. My last ex. A shout out. A young woman, but youth doesn’t mean lab rat stupid. She had not only free will, but wisdom. I really respect her, and I don’t know how to say it in a way that won’t sound like “oneitis” to people. Think of a friend or grandmother or anyone you intimately know and trust to eventually sooner or later make good decisions for themselves while at the same time being as kind to others as possible. That was V. I’m so glad to have been influenced by her. I learned a lot, from someone half my age. For one thing I learned that it’s possible to be low drama kind and happy. That’s a fraction of it. Anyway, you never know whats around the corner – there are surprising men and women, who are worthy of respect and admiration.

I have more and more shout-outs. Maybe I’ll get to them in post updates.

Mistakes I made in my last business

A few years ago I had many employees working on engineering new technology that was well timed for the market and should have done quite well financially.

It was a good idea, at the right time.

A major problem was finding qualified tech and software engineers in Indonesia. The education system here is very inadequate, and the few talented workers usually are snapped up by foreign countries that have more established and better paying tech companies.

But I also mis-managed. I wasn’t in the office, face to face enough. But I think a big problem was cultural. I really messed up in not being sensitive enough to the conservative culture.

I’m the type of guy who gets off on having public sex. I’ve done quite a lot of it, and I kind of like aggravating people by getting them horny and gossiping. I actually think it’s a positive public service. That overall it makes people happier, and gives them good memories.

But some of my employees left, they said, because I lived on the top floor of the 4th story large office/factory, and had two or three girls who would visit, and the drama leaked out all over the place. For instance I once had to physically carry out a hysterical screaming girl. And I had a westerner on the second floor for a time who had discovered chi-kung sex and him and his main squeeze were extremely loud and frequent. I’m loud too, but as far as I know they couldn’t hear me downstairs from the 4th floor.

I lost some good engineers because of this. One I kept trying to hire back, but he said he wanted to only work for a Muslim company. Another left saying it didn’t feel right to work in a living space, but I know it was code for the drama of my unconventional lifestyle. The girls would often hang out downstairs in the kitchen and sometimes gossip with the staff.

I don’t think any of the female staff were put off. Strangely enough, girls seem to get it. They get it that some guys are going to get a lot of attention, and have multiple girls, and I never got any sense from any of the girls that they were even slightly put off by it.

And some of the guys seemed totally fine. But emotions are tricky. We might not really know why we have them. I have a theory that when people are jealous they don’t usually know that they are jealous. They know that they are offended and angry. They feel that something wrong is happening.

I was extremely insensitive to this. I always thought that it’s simply other people’s problem, and that it was due mostly to ignorance or closed mindedness.

Which was not only insensitive to others feelings, but was financially foolish, and outright mis-management.

It’s not just a cultural difference; I once knew a westerner who complained about my girlfriend, a girl he actually dated first, that she was too loud a screamer in bed, and that this was very rude to the neighbors. I remember once touring with her down from the mountains into town while she was still in a bra on the back of my bike, and he thought this was hugely insensitive to the locals. I didn’t really get either of his viewpoints, at the time. Maybe I’ll never be able to actually empathize, but I can at least care.

I’m a bit of a rascal about deliberately making people sexually jealous. In Thailand I’d revel in the hate stares that the older female tourists would constantly be giving me. It made me feel I was doing it right. They wanted to assume that the girls were somehow abused prostitutes, and tried their best to be oblivious to the impossible to ignore obvious body language of the girls being incredibly doting and smitten. It’s never young hotties that are bothered; my attractive young partners usually attracted around them, especially on the dance floor, a coterie of similarly hot young things. Girls get status associating with similar beauty, so they quickly form cliques, and none of the other hotties ever had any problem with the age and attractiveness disparity at all. So the obvious theory of mind is that the older women were trying to culturally enforce a rule that older men aren’t allowed to date younger women, because it’s too threatening to the stability of long term marriage, and the value of older women. So fuck em, I always thought. I love being out with a hottie and bothering the older women.

Some guys express the idea that it’s actually disgusting and laughable for an older guy to date younger women. They assume that the girls are somehow purchased and would not associate with an older man for any other reason other than provisioning. They get physical revulsion, and think it’s disgusting. Of course this is clearly self serving ignorance. The girls I’m with are very obviously and clearly smitten, and sometimes would cry in public if distressed, or cause huge drama trying to get me back and being monogamous, etc etc etc. Very clear and obvious signals that are impossible to ignore, without an extreme effort at denying reality. So I usually think fuck the guys too. Petty jealousy, clearly.

So I’ve been quite the rascal about it. As if I’m performing a public service by being so counter-cultural, and wandering around town with very much younger hot little girls dressed up to arouse more than mere attention.

And the girls usually revel in this too – and revel in public sexuality – especially loud noises where they know neighbors can hear. They are proud of their sexuality, and get off on the attention too. Girls with above average sexual prowess and attractiveness like to flaunt it and lord it over the others, as a type of super power, especially when they feel they have landed a valuable man that other girls could not get. This is primal; female monkeys are known to have extremely loud sex with with a top alpha monkey in the troup, to advertise their sexual status in the troupe. Their sexual value.

But these seemingly unequal flaunted partnerships do upset some people – older women and younger men, mostly. The ones who would consider me as going against their interests. Young guys don’t want interlopers stealing up all the hot women; they think those belong to them. And older women hate men being out of their control to police. And again, people who are jealous deliberately NEVER know this. They don’t think they are feeling jealousy. There isn’t that type of introspection built into how jealousy works. They feel angry, disgusted, and morally outraged. “It’s so disgusting that that hottie is orgasming on your cock! Horrible! How dare you, you immoral, wrinkly, evil old man!”

Still though, loud fucking where the neighbors can hear? That’s just a part of life, isn’t it? I’ve heard neighbors before; usually it’s the girls who are the screamers, and I just can’t get it how this could bother someone.

I’ve also in the past been highly insensitive to the tremendous heartbreak that the women in my life were put through. They were of course always free to leave me. Right? Weren’t they? Or were they? When you are deeply in love, you aren’t free at all. You can’t turn that off. Eventually you’ll probably snap, but until you do, there is very little freedom. People get obsessed, and love can be choiceless. We don’t say “fall in love” for nothing. You don’t walk into love, you fall uncontrollably; it’s not volitional. And if it’s not volitional, there really isn’t exactly a lot of freedom to leave.

And I knew that and deliberately worked it, for years, with girls who kept telling me they were in pain.

I’ve been monogamous for over 11 months now, and don’t have the same hunting hunger that once completely dominated my life. It’s not a philosophical choice, and I can’t honestly apologize or say I was wrong before. I seemed to be doing what I seemed to have to do at the time. It made sense at the time. But it’s a nice low drama change of pace that heartbreak and drama isn’t built right into the very fabric of who I am and what I do now.

My girl and I are both rather liberally minded, and sometimes imagine somewhat non-traditional activities. But there is no urgency to destabilize our situation. We’re fun loving folks, but I’m not going to underestimate the power of jealousy, and am more sensitive than in the past about pushing people over the edge.

If I had staff again, I’d have to be more sensitive and careful not to be in your face again with non-traditional partnering. That can really bother some people, and although I may never really understand how or why people feel that way, I know that they do.

I’m not quite ready to start my next venture, but am still looking at China. My first visit was very intriguing. I’ll have to learn more about the culture there too; people can harbor resentments, without me knowing, and that can build up and be surprising.

Update: Speaking of “Girls with above average sexual prowess and attractiveness like to flaunt it and lord it over the others, as a type of super power, especially when they feel they have landed a valuable man that other girls could not get.”

Girls are famous for deliberately making other girls jealous. Of course it’s a dangerous game to play, because girls are also always trying to take each other down a few notches. This gets fucking crazy in the Phillipines, where girls use FAKE gossip, all day and all night long. There isn’t the cultural taboo there of lying.

In Canada if you get caught out in a lie, YOU’RE the one who loses face and social status. But it’s not like that in the Phils at all. You can just flat out openly lie with slandering gossip, and it’s fair game. So you get constant crazy bitchy backstabbing wild out of control fake news gossip being slung all over the place.

And admit it guys, you guys do it too. When some guys get emotional, they can really be little bitches about it, and slander other guys with ZERO interest in what the truth is. This is especially true when it comes to older guys being with younger women. Guys get jealous, don’t really fully appreciate what the roots of their emotions are, and will very deliberately avoid knowing anything about the real situation, unless it confirms their negative emotion. They WANT to be slanderous. They don’t want the truth at all.

I’ve heards it said that humans aren’t rational. We are limbic, and just happen to have an available rationality, that is controlled by the limbic system. We can appear rational, but most often it’s our primal monkey brain that dominates.

Chimps are fucking vicious social creatures, and social positioning includes constant political power plays. Yes, we want high status, but that will CERTAINLY make others jealous, and jealousy makes others want to bring you down, the first opportunity they get to safely do so. Because it will bring them up.

But we don’t feel or know that this is what we are doing. We feel righteous and indignant.

And yet as soon as the very guy who was bitching about old ugly guys with hot girls gets old and gets a taste, he miraculously changes his tune, and falls into infatuation, and suddenly it’s all good.

Suddenly instead of being irritated at guys acting too big for their britches, he’s getting a small thrill out of being king of the hill for a change, and gets a little bit of pleasure flaunting his status and making other people uncomfortably jealous.

The politics of the inherited limbic system.

A relevant comment Nash made on theredquest

The “petit-maitre” is the type of player Feher uses in those quotes. The “littleness” (petit) there (I believe) is in contrast to a full-on Liberterine, that not only wants the sex… but wants polite society to watch while he does impolite things (he wants that more than the sex, actually). He wants to rub a type of wild, sexual chaos in the face of the Victorian types. I understand the appeal… but I don’t share it.

Thank you to my silent readers.

Sometimes I look at my stats to see what pages each viewer visits. I’m heartened when people linger and read many posts, and come back for more.

I do get discouraged sometimes, by a lack of page views, and lack of comments. But I can see that some people are into it, and some of the comments are incredible quality; really good.

So, thanks, and welcome, and hi again to all the very long time readers and commentors. I’ve always wanted to make a community of people who really like and respect each other, and I’ve been re-reading some comments, and they are pretty fucking amazing. I mean, I have a high opinion of myself, but it’s not in a vaccum – some of you guys are my superiors, and put up with me graciously. And there are no sycophants here, and thanks for that too.

Why trying to emulate a player archetype in order to seduce can be horribly counterproductive.

I’d push back a little here… you’re not wrong… but guys that aren’t “certain” of themselves will be distracted by this. They (in some cases) might be better trying on an archetype… rather than trying to invent one of their own.

In the beginning… men have a lot of false theories. And so much uncertainty. “Copying” a successful guy can be a reasonable first step…

I’ve used the example of comedians before. And writers. And musicians. It’s very common to start out emulating a style, but there is never big success without growing into a highly unique individuality. No one successful is completely derivative; it’s about discovering and creating novelty. Novelty is highly attractive, and you can’t copy novelty.

When teaching meditation it’s always done to teach both the absolute and relative views at the same time. That’s Buddhist speak for teach the advanced technique at the same time as the beginner technique. Because sometimes we’ll be able to be advanced, right from the beginning, and always we need direction and an over-arching view of where we can aim and head for.

So for meditation, it’s taught that you can rest your mind and not try to fight against thoughts, and just be present, without really doing anything. But for beginners that doesn’t work at all. They’ll just daydream or fall asleep. So you teach focus and slapping your mind upside the cheek every time you have a thought, to bring yourself back to the focus.

But then sometimes even beginners relax. So they need to know it’s fine to relax. That it’s best to relax. So you teach both mindfulness, and awareness.

For game you can’t just teach K and R selection and what to emulate. That misses the big picture and the whole point.

There are highly charismatic married men who provide for their many girlfriends, and get laid like crazy and have devoted love slaves and are charming as fuck.

Absolutely nothing to do with K or R. That’s a side show, that has nothing to do with nothing.

It’s just a distraction.

Like focusing on a candle flame is just a distraction. Not the point at all.

I mean, a candle flame can be a point. But it’s not what meditation is, anymore than visualization or chi-kung or hatha yoga or kundalini is meditation. There are infinite good types of meditation, even if dzogchen or formless meditation is perhaps an example of the penultimate insight.

You can meditate on being an archetypal bad boy, with the costume to match, and that can “work”. Or you can meditate on being a married professor, and that can work at least as well.

The form is nearly irrelevant and that’s incredibly important to know.

Because people have predilections.

I used to do mantra meditation before I met my community which focused on shamata vipassana. They explained to me that they preferred if I just did what everyone else did, down to the smallest details of the form.

So I learned their style of sitting meditation, but eventually I refused to do the suggested technique of imagining my self going out into the room on the out-breath. That gave me a headache. This did not make me popular with a few of the meditation teachers, who considered me stubborn and arrogant. Only later, in that community, was I introduced to various Tibetan teachers who explained many other forms of shamata vippasana, and my personal technique that I seemed to have invented was described back to me as a real thing called dzogchen.

In that community people also “graduated” from sitting meditation to doing complex visualizations and chanting. I was told that my simple practice had more profound effects on me personally than the gains that many of the senior students were getting from visualization. And I could not visualize at all, and I still can’t.

So predilection is a really big deal. You don’t want to try to be a bad boy pump and dumper if really you are into having girlfriends and even living with them. It would be stupid to do that, really. It’s also completely irrelevant.

You’ve got to put some faith in your own interests, and follow the ones that give the best returns. There are infinite ways to be attractive; you don’t have to choose to be something that you are not interested in being. It’s when you are interested in something that you get especially good at it. And getting especially good at something is attractive.

When it comes to becoming attractive, you really do have to be into what you are doing and who you are becoming. You can’t just be angry at the sluts you are fucking and throw away all personal responsibly for treating yourself and others well with hand waiving towards giving in to “the decline”. No, when it comes to being attractive, it’s attractive to actually love the women you fuck. It’s very unattractive not to. Communities that avoid this obvious fact are clearly broken and twisted and promoting poor mental and social health.

I’d like to think that people would easily come to this intuition inside themselves, if they take some time to open to their own hearts and minds. There are some intuitions that are clearly better to follow than teachings. Teachers don’t know you. They don’t know your life.

In fact that is an explicit and often stated Buddhist teaching. If you have to choose between a teachers instructions and your own well thought out beliefs, go with your own. I was taught that many times. That helps to make Buddhism self correcting and evolving. You discover your truth, you don’t adopt someone else’s.

What is true for you, in seduction, will eventually with certainty become vastly different than what is true for anyone else. You should know that from the beginning, because you need to give yourself permission to become what you want to become, and have relationships with girls who you actually like. And the types of relationships that you actually like.

The idea that either K or R selected, provider or cad, is sexier and gets you laid faster with more or better quality women is really facile. Really extra-ordinarily over simplified to the point of being wrong. A total sideshow.

Many facts of life were discovered by simple mind experiments, including Einsteins theory of relativity. Simple mind experiment: imagine you are a girl, and are way into this charming charismatic man who has firm boundaries and is great in the sack. One day he offers to pay for a trip to a foreign country. And your university schooling. And your apartment. Are you suddenly going to be into him LESS?!!

It’s completely absurd, and the entire concept is mostly used as rationalization for people to do what they are already inclined to do, while putting themselves in the best possible light.

It’s a rationalization that intimacy makes you weak, and that your lack of going after it is a sign of strength and charisma.

But it’s the complete opposite.

Retaining women’s passion and insane levels of devotion that makes them literal human slaves is a HUGE skill, MORE valuable than picking them up. Way way way more valuable.


I’ve been living with J for over 11 months. She moved in basically on the first date. And she still tells me that she loves me more than 20 times a day and is obsessively crazy head over heels for me, dotes on me constantly, oral and sex not only on demand, but offered up constantly, to the point of distraction. This is normal. This has been my normal for many many years with many many women.

It’s not random chance and accident. I’ve been documenting about this here for ages. And she’s only 22 to my 52, slim, and noticeably above average in attractiveness. Also completely normal. I haven’t dated anyone over 23 in ages, unless they grew into being older, and they nearly always do. Women stay with me as long as they can bear it if I’m not monogamous, and usually come back to me over and over if they break up.

That’s all normal, and it’s a thing. A thing that has nothing to do with K or R or provider or not provider. The sliders are various – getting focused on one slider to distraction is a HUGE mistake.

Now many people online have an agenda and try to work backwards from their preconceptions when they pretend to use reason. So they’ll say that my results are due to my location. Not influenced by, but due to. Even though I’ve never met or even heard of any other westerner (or local) getting anything close to similar results, living in any country. My results are at minimum extraordinarily rare, and extremely consistent. The people who try to put it down to location could never replicate my results merely by changing their own location, and they know it, so when asked if it’s true then why don’t they also move, they ALWAYS come up with some bullshit “reason” why they are not able or interested to do so.

Rationalizations and backward rationalizations account for a good deal of what is pawned off as reason in too many discussions, even by leaders and so called experts. People do what they are comfortable doing, and then explain why they are doing it, using their internal press secretary, and sounding all logical when it’s really all limbic.

People use “reasons” to pump and dump and avoid intimacy, build up huge systems of what attraction is, discount and dismiss any information that contradicts their mental maps (such as that it’s been scientifically proven that women orgasm more for wealthy men, and that women DON’T have a dual mating strategy and DON’T show different mate preferences when ovulating when they are married to high testosterone men). It’s very often a collusion of like minded men who gather into self selected groups, and you get in-group out group group mind thinking.

It’s very dangerous, when people are looking for advice for how to be happier. Very dangerous to stumble upon these giant group mind consensus that seem so “reasonable”.

And we can’t point all our fingers at the guys generously trying to teach what they know. The problems really start from the bureaucratically minded noobs, who think that there are rules and secret systems that they can learn. “Oh, that’s beta behavior!” they’ll expertly admonish, from the comfort of their lounge chair. They will learn the rules and roles of a group and become an excellent parrot, all the while having very little real life experience, and yet will chime in with their expert opinion daily. Their opinion about what they have read, and their very few experiences based on very underdeveloped social skills with girls.

These are the guys that make monsters out of teachers, because it gives the teachers feedback that is insanely out of touch with reality. Newbies will of course often have twisted mentalities that are immature and outright unhealthy. No one knows what it is that he doesn’t know, but it can be worse with newbs – they can “know” bad attitudes such that they ask how to get to the wrong place. “How can I be expert at seducing women who are twisted mind fucking human rent-a-bikes?” “How can I be expert at avoiding heartbreak or commitment or attachment?” And the teachers have to answer over and over questions from broken or underdeveloped mind-sets, and hear parroted back as gospel their worst ideas. Until an entire cannon of bad ideas is built up, that they then identify with, defend, and build upon.

We have a word for keyboard jockeys in Buddhism too. They are called scholars. Buddhism is about hearing, contemplating, and meditating. It’s the meditation that makes personal transformation. Dating is analogous to meditating. Contemplating about YOUR OWN FUCKING PERSONAL real life relationships is helpful. Disclosing your thoughts about your own real lived life is brave and helpful. Contemplating about second and third and infinitely off hand reports and theories of others is mind wank keyboard jockeying that adds noise and prevents personal and group insight and growth.

And another comment I made over at Nash’s blog:

Before there is muscle memory, there is learning. Sometimes it’s conscious aha moments, especially for things like no doesn’t mean no. That’s a fun one to learn. I’ve tried to explain, using examples, how no doesn’t mean no many times on forums, and it’s usually not well received.

It’s one of those things you have to learn for yourself. You have to live the nuance, and get the real feedback, to make it real and useful. It’s not an idea, it’s an experiential reality. The idea is only a map after you experience the territory. Otherwise it’s like explaining the color red to a blind person.

Treat em mean to keep em keen is like that too. You might have an idea about it that won’t work for you, but if you live an experience that very broadly fits into that map, it will not be negative to you. Just like no doesn’t mean no seems VERY negative to most people, but is completely positive to anyone who actually lives through the experiences.

But I do agree, I prefer low drama women who don’t demand negative treatment. Absolutely. Mental health is a very serious issue, and impacts hugely on our quality of life. The principal doesn’t have to be extreme, it can be subtle. For instance yesterday J said “Kiss me”, and I said “No.” She was shocked, then beamed a big smile at me and congratulated me for the balls. She was really impressed, and it was like I passed a test.

That could fall into the category of treat em mean to keep em keen; have boundaries and expectations, and don’t always comply with demands, just because she makes them. And if you are not treated up to your reasonable expectations, sometimes you need to be forceful. As forceful as required. If you are not as forceful as required, then it’s bad parenting, more likely, than merely a bad woman.

Why people insist on using tone knobs to blend the ranges of providers and betas

I left a comment on Nash’s blog today, and I’d like to expand on it.

Nash said:

I took tons of new, rare, interesting reference experiences from my times with Pixie Girl and Baby Dragon. I didn’t fuck either of them… but I took big leaps fwd in my education… at a stage in my game when “big leaps” are rare.

Wolves > Rabbits… every time. Of this, I am sold.

I like your mental map of growing reference experiences. Ya, I think reference experiences can be like a type of muscle memory, similar to how learning piano is a build up of things we actually do, more than things we think, feel, or believe.

And your idea of wolf being better than rabbit reminds me of a something that has been bothering me for many years in popular pua mental maps – that there is a tone knob that twists from beta on one end to alpha on the other, or a tone button that twists from provider to alpha. Many people make it the same tone knob.

Strange mental map for people to use, considering tone knobs have been out of fashion and people mostly use graphic equalizers now.

It’s a completely separate knob between provider and cad compared to beta and alpha. They are only related if you MAKE them related, by sliding them at the same time.

And I agree – wolf is way more fulfilling in most every way than rabbit, if you do it well; more passion, more return on investment, more connection, more of just about anything people value. If by wolf you mean longer term relationships vs pump and dump.


I’ve been promising to write about better ways to think about seduction, game, relationships. I think many of the memes that are common in some online communities are more wrong than right – and just right enough to be credible.

For instance there is this incredibly stupid idea that alpha fucks and beta bucks. It’s based on the truth that there are some betas who are also providers, and that there are some alphas who are also mostly into pump and dump.

I was given the opportunity for a free evaluation of one of Krausers books a few years ago, on the condition that write a review. Krauser said he didn’t care if it was a positive or negative review, as long as I wrote something. I reneged on my responsibility, as I was not able to bring myself to get through the book, as he had built, from the beginning, a premise of attraction that has nothing to do with my reference experiences. He talked about dressing and behaving like a bad boy cad as a means to increase attraction and get laid more.

That’s completely different than what I do or care to do or need to do. Now that may be true, for him, but it’s not TRUE.

Krauser is a good and thoughtful and insighful writer, but I could not finish that seduction guide because it’s premise was all about K versus R selection, provider and beta, and it seemed to want to mold the seducer into something, regardless of what he is. You can’t make yourself into something that you don’t identify with – you have to become your better real self.

We BUILD our worlds, and how people relate to us. We decide who we are, and what types of groupies we could attract. We create our characters and magnetize people around us who are interested in those characters.

You don’t have to do anything remotely close to what Krauser suggests in order to be a magnetic charismatic seductive character.

Which is why recently I questioned whether his entire philosophy of seduction was at its root flawed.

Now that’s not to say that he’s not great at what he does, or that he doesn’t understand women or have keen and hard won unusual insights into some of the workings of women.

I’m suggesting something far more mind blowing and broad.

I’m saying that he’s right, but that might have nothing whatsoever to do with how YOU can be right about women.

Or how I can be right about women.

He’s going to be right in his own, unique way. Women will deal with him uniquely; not in the same way as they deal with a category of men. That’s the whole point of learning and practicing charm. You become treated differently. It’s tautological to the entire process. You wan’t women to tell you “you’re not like anyone I’ve ever known”.

But you don’t get grouped like Krauser thinks you do. There is not a secret society army of cloned bad boys that you can emulate. We ALL get treated differently. All women, all men. ALL of us get treated very differently, within the first 5 seconds of meeting someone. People pick up on the most profoundly subtle of cues, and our vibe discloses our attitude and history as if it were a scent that a bloodhound could pick up.

When people get positive feedback from some women, when we try to know how and why that works, we can’t just look somewhere and see the answer. We have to make up theories. The mental maps for what we are doing that works can be way off. Because what works is built up over time subconsciously through real life feedback. Why does your golf swing work well? You might not be able to either communicate or even know most of why.

You can create a rich history of being a libertine lover, as Krauser does, and that will affect how you are perceived. But it has very little to do with wearing a leather jacket and rings, unless that’s what you want to incorporate into your image. You don’t need that image. You can create any image you want. As long as you get positive feedback for it.

Just look at the human species. We are very varied. Survival of the fittest doesn’t mean survival of the bad boy, or provider, or diplomat, or warrior, or baker, or thug, or genius. It means everyone who procreated found a niche that WORKED. There isn’t just two niches; provider and cad. There are more than you can imagine. You can be any niche you want.

I was re-reading a post I made that was a copy of an old rvforum thread that I participated in.
The posts that got me a 1 week ban from RooshVForum

I’m still amazed at how irrational and delusional and dissimulating were many of the rvforum member commentors, on insisting that Mark Minter getting married when previously he was had set himself up as the guru of swearing off marriage was akin to going back on the principles of not being a pedophile.

The reason for the lack of reason is clear. The RVF members suffered from a type of cluster A schizoid personality disorder, where they view intimacy with paranoid scepticism and see indulging in intimacy as pathological and a sign of terrifying weakness. When Mark realized that he actually wanted intimacy, and that he was wrong about his basic human nature, the RVF group-think mob turned on him in anger and declared him an excommnunicated outsider. Some were disgusted and angry. They felt actually betrayed, as if he didn’t just make a life decision about his own fucking business, but that he had betrayed a contract with them.

Which is why for a long time I’ve been calling out people with that mindset as being little boys trying to create a He-Man-Woman-Haters-Club-of-Relationship-Fail.

People who have either never had a long term relationship or been burned by them, deciding that therefore long term relationships are bad.

And in order to feel good about themselves, they gather together and
1) blame women for their relationship failures
2) blame society for their relationship failures.
3) blame the very idea of having a relationship itself as a failure, that only weak blue pillers would do.

These guys were so heavily invested in being anti-intimacy, that they put up with Roosh banning everyone who hinted at any other view of intimacy, on or off the forum. He would actually ban people for ideas that they expressed OUTSIDE of the forum. They rallied around him as if their group was actually a thing.

Foolish. They don’t form a group. There is no men’s movement. Men don’t have a collective bargaining position. Each one of us is completely on his own when it comes to each unique vagina that will either get moist for us or not. Each completely on his own as to what is his bargaining position and skill for negotiating how well he is treated. That’s a private affair, and no group movement of mens rights activists anti-feminists is going to have any influence in how individual or groups of women behave towards you.

So the framework for a better way to think about being attractive and maintaining passionate loving relationships with girls that you are really into is not about wearing leather jackets or about avoiding being a provider or about emulating behaviors of those you think are in a secret society. It’s not about avoiding feminists or acting either K or R selected. It’s about creating positive reference experiences that build up your muscle memory. And crucially, it’s not random wandering into positive feedback – you could get that from heroin. It’s feedback that is towards a goal. Feedback in line with your long term mission. For becoming more attractive and better at maintaining passion with women who are good for you.

This won’t look like what someone else is doing, most likely. It will be your true, authentic self, giving and receiving true, authentic love and passion. We all have our very different flavors, and are not fungible, and all are treated that way. There is no group called women, no group called men, who all are like that, and there isn’t an exceptional third group of chads that women treat differently as if they were a third sex.

There is something we call the human condition, and there are basic sex differences, but the human condition includes more variability than anyone can conceive; the more experience you have with women, not only the more similarities can you see, but also the more incredible variety. Just as different women bring out vastly different responses in you, so it works in reverse; and it’s not because of types. It’s because of individuals.

There is who you make yourself and how you treat people. You can’t make yourself into something that you don’t identify with – you have to become your better real self.

How meditation and chi-kung make you sexy

Ken left a great comment that makes a good standalone post.

I think getting into qigong and meditation would be vital for the 60 year old guy. He needs everything he can to build attraction and qigong and meditation really helps with the internal stuff.

Also some workshops in tantric sex is a great way to learn sensual and erotic intelligence.

Mens workshops that work with masculinity is a great way to work deeply with masculine energy.

Learning some form of martial art would help a lot.

There are good qigong resources here including stuff that works specifically on sexual energy:


This exercise is great for building up sexual energy:

The standing meditation postures horse stance and San Ti she are especially good for building masculine energy.

For game/inner game I would highly recommend these two guys:


Sans company has some great programs:


I think their approaches jive well with Xsplats approach and I think they would be much healthier alternatives than what is often recommended to guys.

The No More Mister Nice Guy book can be very helpful. So can the Forum connected to the book:


This book is good too:

Some therapy is often very helpful in addressing psychological issues that may underpin some of the issues one has with women.

Best of luck. Never too late to start.

Once again I want to thank you for your comment. I suppose I might harp on a bit too much about the popular crowd of people looking for excuses and scapegoats for why they suffer and feel mistreated. Although 90% of absolutely everything is shit (books, movies, political movements, etc), and although most hurting men are looking for the fastest way to feel better – which is to collectively scapegoat, there really is a big movement of men who try to help each other self improve and take the serenity prayer seriously. I was looking at the red-pill reddit and was heartened to see very little whining and quite a lot of positivity and actionable content and guys posting their progress and giving tips on what to actually do to improve their lot.

So good to see. Hopefully I overestimate the negative effects of the old big three R’s. Each R once deserved to be a loud voice to a large group, but each slowly morphed and changed and either got corrupted, overstretched their abilities, stagnated, or went slightly mad. So again, so heartening to see a comment like yours which is simple sanity and goodwill with practical actionable advice.

Qi-gong and meditation are like lifting weights. It’s a required maintenance, and if you really get into it you get noticeably more attractive.

Actually chi-kung can be a spiritual power, in any sense that such a concept can be meaningful to you.

Lately my sex drive has been low. I’ve been living with the same lovely young girl for 10 months, and even though she is extremely easy to live with and constantly shows great interest and effort, this last week I noticed myself neglecting my manly duties in bed.

Today I put on some high powered music – the live stage show version of the War of the Worlds, and did some higher power chikung than the weak punk ass chi-kung I’ve been doing lately, then forcibly threw my girl down on the bed and licked her up before ravaging her to multiple orgasms.

It was about time. I’d gotten a bit complacent. How much power and love and mojo and sexual heat I carry in my body is a personal choice. It can be enough to maintain sex multiple times a day with the same girl, if I keep a strong practice up and the girl is compatible.

Or I can let my body and mind slide and the passion will fizzle. It’s got nothing to do with hypergamy – that’s all on me – all within my domain of control. Just like lifting weights.

In fact today is also gym day. And tomorrow I won’t be eating any food. Looking my best and having strong loving spiritually powerful sexual mojo is a choice, but it takes constant renewal and effort. It’s not just a matter of what words to say, it’s a lifestyle choice that requires constant maintenance.

Feeling chi-kung strongly requires a bit of willingly being kind of special. Personally I don’t have metaphysical beliefs that chi is a “real” thing, and consider it the kinesthetic sense, that maps onto subconscious body and emotional process as a type of synesthesia. Synesthesia is where people see colors associated with letters, or hear sounds associated with shapes, etc. Chi-kung can make conscious and under control what is usually below our threshold of perception and control, and to feel it strongly requires a kind of giving in to being something very different than a normal man. You become extra-ordinary. You can, with practice and if you want, feel great power in your sex chakra, and a huge heart of heat and love, and energy above your head, and a sea of deep rooted self below your feet. Or you can just mildly feel a ball of something between your palms and wave that around. You can go as deep and big as you like, or just mildly touch in. Obviously when you go deep you feel a great deal more during sex, and sex becomes chi-kung sex, and this effects the woman greatly. The more you feel, the more she will feel. Mirror neurons are a thing.

Starting from nothing at 60

I hope that I’m not overstepping boundaries here, pulling a comment into a post again. But we all have our anonymity.

John said:

X, what you espouse is fine and dandy. However, I’m sure I’m not alone in this:
Almost all my life, since becoming sexually aware, every woman with whom I wanted to become romantic said to me some version of, “You’re such a great guy, you’re going to make some girl a great catch.” But never her. Whatever woman I heard that from always passed my romantic desires into the future, and on to some other fictional woman “out there.”
For forty years, as I am now 60, the same gentle yet devastating rejection. Over and over again.
Enter the internet, and Game. A day late and a dollar short. Late to the table again, I missed dinner.
At 60, I cannot make up for lost time. I am stuck with over 40 years’ worth of memories of nights sleeping in an empty bed.
So if the Three Rs don’t have the answer for younger men to the same plight that I have suffered, who does? You? If so, time’s a wasting. If a man cannot learn how to get over the first hurdle, he cannot finish the race, let alone win it.

Hi John. I understand and empathize. I used to get the same words from girls, all the time. Some even went so far as to say that they used to think that I was gay. It was bad, for many years.

Before and after I divorced, at age 24, I dated, but not as much as I needed. Before and after, older women saw me in a better light. Even my wife was 12 years older – but at 36 she was holding up perfectly fine, at first.

Things improved for me the more I dated. I did date a few young hotties, but it was easier to keep older women interested in me, and I also used to fly in an Indonesian girl to live with me off and on over three years. It was the Indo girl who taught me how to be dominant in a relationship, as she was culturally and naturally submissive, plus my employee. Since then I’ve treated every girl as my employee.

If you are 60 and want to make up for lost time, can you relocate to a country more favorable for a man of your age to date? The ex for my 21 year old Filipina, back when I was living there at age 39, was 60. And his newer replacement girl was at least as stunningly incredibly hot. Nineteen, as I recall.

If you do relocate, chances are it will take a few years of learning curve to get out of the chump zone. That’s normal.

Reading stuff on the old Roissy blog, pre 2012 might be a big help towards being dominant and playful and charming with girls. I can’t see much value on Rollos blog in terms of that, but if you can then great. Just be careful not to swallow his poisonous idea that you will stop being dominant and charming the moment you assume a provider role. That’s self defeating garbage advice used only as panacea for wounded men to feel better about not being able to turn around their social positions within their current relationships, and to prevent heartbreak in their future ones. As actual game advice it’s anti-game. Learned helplessness that keeps men down.

Roissy teaches bullshit learned helpless too – especially now, with his insane dark triad nonsense. You are what you are, and if you fake that then you are not loved, and care not. It’s difficult for most guys to tease out the wheat from the chaff.

As for Roosh, I have not read his books, but I’m not aware that he gives any dating advice at all, or that he dates. He gives seduction advice and he “busts a nut”, as he calls it. Both him and the girls he masturbates into seem completely disinterested in ever meeting again. That’s complete failure in my opinion, on so many levels. From before the beginning all the way to finishing too soon.

As for my blog, I try my best, but it’s incredibly difficult to give dating advice. Mostly I talk about my own life, which is often a bit fucked up, and of course requires my personality at the center of it. You’ll have to tease out the wheat here also. I plan to write some ground breaking and important new pieces, but frankly am a bit put off by the lack of comments here, so keep putting it off.

The key is to date date date. Blogs and advice can help, but you’ve got to date.

At your age that will be much easier in countries where the girls are poor and into dating older guys. If you put a lot of time and effort into learning charm, you will be surprised what genuine feelings young women can have for older men.

People with no experience of young women or girls from other countries have no option but to sqeeze square pegs into round holes. They’ll think that the girls are only with you for money, fake their orgasms, and won’t love you.

Ya, even the girl might think that at first. But it’s straight up biology. The poor things do fall in love, and will orgasm, and will get quite attached, if you know how to be charming as fuck, a great lay, and dominant. More than likely you’ll get marriage proposals more than you like, once you learn how to be fully social that way.

But of course the more socially skilled you are, and the higher up the value ladder you make yourself, the more options you’ll have with what types of relationships you can create and sustain. Some people put more than one girl into the same house. Some do partner swapping. Some maintain open relationships. The types of relationships people have been having are innumerable. Just never judge a book by it’s cover. It’s how your woman treats you that determines your status in her eyes. Not how keyboard jockeys put pegs into holes.

Charisma and musical development are synonymous

I’m playing around on my acoustic six string this morning, and have thoughts about improv that I think reverberate and echo widely into game and life.

When I was 16 I’d goof around haphazardly on the family stand up piano in the basement. Being of mild cluster C tentencies (anorexia, obsessive compulsive, struggling against neurotic thoughts) I liked to do a lot of tricky finger excersices. My thinking was that this would naturally lead into musical ability.

Later I wandered into the high school music classroom, during a free period, when all students could structure their own time. One guy was doing some simple chord progressions, with some non-technical melody in the right hand, using a slow tempo. It was a life changeing eye opener that I’ve never forgotten. I tell this story often. He put emotion into his music, and that was far more important than a universe of technical ability. It drew people in, drew him in, drew me in. It was an ability from another universe. I had no idea how he did that.

It would take me many decades of life and feeling and being open to emotions of every kind to be able to have something to bring to and pull out of the piano. The piano now is a completely different thing to me, because I’m a different thing.

We create our realities, within biological and physical and social constraints. But those constraints are bigger than any of us can comprehend. Music itself has been evolving over the centuries, and faster and faster. Social structures are also opening to more and more options. There is tremendous room within the facts to CREATE facts. Technology is the perfect example of this. We not only live within a bounded reality, but we use what we are given to paint and sculpt and compose and dance and sing and write and fuck our way into new worlds, that we create as we discover them.

You can make more beautiful and simply better music, using one string played emotionally, than 6 or 8 played with virtuosity. Guitar teachers, in fact any teacher, will tell you to try to avoid starting with bad habits.

Some teachers will tell you to never play even one note that doesn’t sound sweet. Focus on the sound, not the melody.

It’s similar with seduction and maintaining passionate romance. Technical game ability can get in the way of the moment – it’s not about your routine, or even quite so much about what you say. Or even do. It’s about emotion and what you are mutually creating into and out of your instrument. With seduction and charisma, your instrument is the other person. You are dancing emotions with her, feeding your emotions in and pulling her emotions out. Is the note sweet? Start with the note, and if you move on to melodies and beats, always pay attention to the note.

The guitar string can convey emotion just out of one note, depending on how you play it, and of course single string melodies can bring out more emotions. Add more strings and you can incorporate more elements of music, such as a repeating base line, or even a harmonic melodic base line. You can slide one string while plucking an open one. You can use double entendre and nuance, and convey several emotions at once; longing, sadness, joy, bitter sweet struggle, devotion.

Charisma and game is exactly like that.

You need to be able to first make one sweet note, then expand out, never losing the feel for what music fundamentally is embedded in, which is emotion.


Ultimately music is about creating and playing our own compositions. Mussorgsky changed the nature of music in his lifetime, it has been said, BECAUSE he was unschooled. He din’t know any better than to make something new. If you learn some musical patterns, or game patterns, these can not only open up possibilities, but they will also usually limit your view of what are your options. You’ll stick to the script, stick to what you believe that the pattern is supposed to be.

But that’s not how you write music, or how you interact with another person. You are always listening to that guitar string, playing with what it is giving to you. Listening to what emotions and sounds and chord progressions and melodies are coming out of the piano.

I’ve been very extreme in my musical development and focus on improv. I’ve learned a few difficult pieces, and these have greately expanded what my improv can be, and I want to learn more and more of other peoples music, but piano or guitar, for me, always comes back to improv. I say piano instead of music, because piano is a person that I interact with – it’s not an abstraction. The guitar is a different person, and brings out very different music.

When you free form improv, either with a woman or guitar, you might use some fundamental structures, but you have to more than merely bend those structures or add a few dissonant notes. You have to be listening to the instrument. Your own moods will come out of it, and yet often surprise you. You’ll be constantly micro-adjusting, or sometimes wildly diverting, based on what you hear. Different parts of your own mind are talking to each other, through your hands, the instrument, and the sound. They could not converse without this medium.


I’ve switched to playing my acoustic in the laptop position. It suits my interests and abilities better. My left hand is damaged and so I can’t play important bar chords used in a strumming style, and learned to prefer a single (or multiple) string finger or plectrum picking style. It’s easier for me to hammer on and off and slide and move around the fretboard with it on my lap. I also use an open tuning, so that I can also strum chords by simply holding all strings down to one fret.

I’ve seen guys use this style of playing on stage. The body language conveys a more contemplative mood, and their music is always far from the heavy metal that must only come from a different guitar posture. The body language suits the music I prefer to make.

This also has a corresponding analogue in charm. I needn’t explain it; I think if you use your imagination you’ll picture it clearer than if I give you the image.

Or maybe you’ll picture something very different than what I have in mind.

Which will prove my point. Game and charisma and music will be altered by your history, perspective, and interests.

This is not something to fight, but to lean into. You’re going to be leaning into the unknown, over and over, and often living well outside of your comfort zone. That’s what music and social interaction does; it expands what you used to think of were your options. That often comes with some emotional strain.


As a teenager I was once invited by two of the most handsome and cool guys in the school to join their clique, and hang around with them. That was too far outside of my comfort zone at the time. I rationalized this discomfort by looking down on them a bit, in my mind. It was a missed opportunity, that I passed up because I was safe in my smaller world.

Game is most often taught as a way to make you happy within a small world – game usually is taught in a way that keeps you safe.

But charisma won’t be what other people teach you, and it won’t be safe. You’ll be learning things that others don’t and can’t possibly know, things unique to you.

And you’ll be opening to new women and their worlds.

In order to gain positive reference experiences, it helps to be a social climber. If you are young, you’ll get good feedback from older women. As you become more worldly you may find your girlfriends and lovers getting younger and younger.

When I was 28 I had a 48 year old lover. At 50 I had a 16 year old one. Plus a 17 year old one plus a 24 year old one, plus a 23 year old one, plus a distant 17 year old one who was considering leaving her fiance for me.

People find it too much an insult to their ego to believe that I am a real guy, telling the truth about his life. It’s too much narcissistic injury. This is one reason I write so many diary type posts; to humanize my dating philosophy and ground it in real life experience, so you can see this as part of the human condition.

Many people will dissimulate like mad to claim that my personal currently lived life and my past experiences can’t possibly relate to what are their own possibilities, if they are even true at all. They don’t much care which option to choose – either it’s fake or irrelevent – all they want is a quick way out of personal responsibility to change their own world. This is a defence mechanism, and nearly always comes from people deliberately keeping their options and world narrow, because it’s far more comfortable that way to them.

How to learn music, seduction, and LTR game.

You’ve changed everything!” * she said, looking up at me with puppy dog eyes and an amazed and laughingly annoyed to be so horribly into me smile.  Yesterday.

A few months ago I’d noticed that J21** was starting to become more irritated, and kept making snarky little emasculating comments.  The quality of sex was declining. Of course that would not do.  Thas was completely my fault, so I changed everything.

I moved to my other place for a few days, stopped eating, and then after giving in to her pleas to be with me again kept a regimen of only eating every second day, and going to the gym each food day.  It took four weeks of that regimen to get the beginnings of a six pack, and to cut a fine figure next to her in the mirror.

I kept up with learning my guitars, improved our living space, hung a heavy boxing bag on the tree, and bought a saxophone.

I told her what I was doing and exactly why.  I told her that it was my job to constantly seduce her and keep her desparately devotedly crazy in love with me.  And that it was her job to devotely suck my dick and come a lot.  You can pull back the curtain; it makes no difference.  As long as you know a woman’s attraction triggers, the point is to push them.

Yesterday she came upstairs and complained about being too in love.  “It hurts!”, she said, holding her heart.  “I’m going fucking crazy!” she said, pointing at her little head. “I’m only downstairs on the 2nd floor, and I can’t stop thinking about you or missing you.”

This is normal.  This is MY normal.  This is something I know how to do, and I do it on purpose.  I like doing it.  It’s more than a hobby, more than a specialty.  More than even a personality.  It’s like music to a musician; it’s impossible NOT to play music, and to learn more and more and get better and better.

If I were to record the simple little daily interactions that I have with J21, each sentence would be a masterclass in seduction.  It’s really that good.  We have a LOT of fun.  Every day.

If Mozart were to talk to you about his music ability, you might want to take how he describes his relative experience as bragging.  But how else can it sound?  He had an innate talent that he cultivated from a young age, and devoted himself to it because he couldn’t help it.  He was tail end of the curve great, so anything he would say about himself would compare himself favorably.

I have some innate language and writing talent that I noticed at age nine, and since then I’ve put in long time and attention to the art of writing.  I find compliments about this encouraging to keep going, and here is an unsolicited compliment I recently discovered on another blog:

He is an expert at conducting MLTRs, plus a rigorous, deep and courageous thinker (and one hell of a writer)… High quality writing from a very original thinker.

I can safely take some pride in my writing, not only because of what qualities I’ve learned to build into it, but because I get social feedback for it.  Self esteem is our interpretation of how others see us, and it’s not narcisism  or bragging to have accurate self esteem.  It would be false modesty, which is also a kind of arrogance, not to be able to accurately position your abilities relative to various crowds.

One thing that always strikes me as interesting is hearing musicians talk about their best works and performances.  Their is no false modesty.  Perhaps because musicians really must be close to the muse.  People who are affected by the muse can never take credit for it.  It doesn’t really belong to us.  We don’t know where it comes from anymore than anyone else does.  So we can’t have false pride; the muse is incredible and deserves any praise she gets.  Musicians are always enthusiastically proud of their best work, and modesty or bragging simply doesn’t enter into the picture.

Learning is also heavily involved with the muse.

I was watching a video by a famous guitarist, who developed some guitar techniques, talk about his techniques and how he discovered them.  There are two aspects about this that I noticed:

  1. He was playing.

    In SEA you usually have to hire two or more workers to do the job of one person, because they don’t find work fun if working alone.  So there will be two people behind the cash register.  It seems insane, but there is some wisdom in it.  We don’t like to do things that are not fun.

    So if you want to learn something, don’t approach it as work.  Instead you need to find ways to make it fun, for you.  That will be personal.

  2. He was putting meditative attention into his learning.  He was immersed in it, having constant flow moments, expanding his awareness into the moment, being as widely present and attentive as possible.  This is another antidote to boredom.  It increases the screen-refresh rate and compresses time and gets your awareness working at a higher clock speed, cramming more and more information into the present moment.  When you do that, you don’t need lots of noise to keep you entertained, because your mind already has quite a lot of information to process.

Every guitarist has a different signature sound. Although you can learn from other guitarists, you can’t be another guitarist. You will be interested in different things, learn different tricks, and specialize.

This is the same for writers. Each writer has a unique voice. Sometimes writers will copy out word for word an entire book of a writer whom they respect, in order to help learn the style, however after time they discover their own voice.

It’s the same story for comedians. Sometimes a comic will be so influenced by a mentor he’ll seem a copycat. Eventually his interests and abilities move him into a style uniquely his own.

The same is true for game and seduction. You can’t copy any PUA. You just can’t. You will have different interests and skills and will respond positively to different feedbacks that interest you more.

As an example I could not and would not emulate Krausers or Blackdragons game strategies. That would be completely impossible for me. I can’t even read Krauser’s seduction guides, as for me the R selected bad boy game is completely disinteresting, and I’ve found so much success with my very different style that I find his entire philosophy of attraction to be fundamentally false, at the root. And I get unstoppably jealous, at times, and so would not be interested in sharing the women I fuck, as BD recommends.

So if you are going to learn things about female nature and seduction from me, you’ll have to keep in mind that you will be CREATING your reality, and the reality that women respond to. You will be creating your own unique voice on the guitar, your own unique voice as a comic, your own unique seduction style. You will be creating an entire world view, and an entire world.

Believe me, you don’t want to be a keyboard jockey.  This blog might be entertaining, but if you are using it purely for entertainment, you are mis-using it.  It’s information you can incorporate into your real lived personal life.  It’s here for a purpose, and a purpose that as a reader I sincerely hope that you will learn to appreciate.

The author of that famous married man’s game post is Hawiian Libertarian.

** J21 is my 21 year old live in girlfriend of 9 months. Her first name starts with J. I’m 52. You’ll see references here to M21 up to M29, N17 up to N22, S16 up to S21, V23 up to V26, and so on.


I’ll come back and write more.  Please always remember that if you get my blog on a feed, that I always update the first draft, so your RSS feed will barely resemble the final post.

Also comment a lot.

How to use LTR game during pickup

In my youth at Buddhist meditation seminars the idea would often be repeated that if you want to fill a cup with knowledge, that you need to empty the cup first.

So I spend a lot of time on this blog just trying to empty cups – trying to kill stupid memes that will prevent the happiness and life that you want.

It is likely that nothing I can say will be able to properly empty your cup – we are all embedded within our reference experiences and no blog is going to alter your reference experiences.

Another Buddhist notion is that the only effective path to change is threefold:

  1. Hearing
  2. Contemplation
  3. Meditation

Reading about how women work on blogs is only helpful if you also think about it and put the knowledge into practice.  Being a keyboard jockey will 100 percent always lead to wrong views.  You need to anchor what you read inside your own real lived personal experience, and contemplate about it to get an appropriate fit, for you.  It’s not enough to get lots of experiences if you don’t read about how to contextualize them and then contemplate to further contextualize and  embody the experiences.

No one can give you the truth about how women behave, because women are all slightly different and will behave towards you differently based on what you bring to the table.  So you can get some good pointers, but never the Truth.  You need to CREATE the truth.

Hearing, contemplating, and action will always lead to different, very personal viewpoints and experiences.

The goal is internalized real viewpoints based on real lived experience.

And to continuously update your viewpoints as you continuosly add new information and experiences – and here is the crucial part – all this must be done within the framework of a goal.  A lifestyle goal. There is no such thing as agnostic information.  Any viewpoint is towards a purpose.

The “truths” about women that men read on blogs can be extraordinarily dangerous, because they are gonzo truths; embodied truths.  True only to that particular life that CREATED that world and worldview.  Women relate to you very specifically based upon what world YOU create.

I suggest that a good goal for your life experiences, which will create your personal and unique embodied world view, is to get better with women and become more happy and give and receive fulfilling love and value.  That’s a lofty goal, but an excellent challenge that adds meaning and value to your own life and the lives of others.

Keyboard jockey knowledge is worse than useless.  It’s a diorama.  Don’t live in a diorama – that will only get in the way of embodying joy.

I have a theory that many people who have women troubles, and are therefore seeking answers online, have some very core issues that can’t be addressed or resolved through online advice.  Some people did not have the healthiest pair bonding and care with their mothers and caregivers as babies and during infancy, and this leads to Cluster A personality disorders, such as schizoid attachment disorder and paranoid views of society.

I don’t know how to address that, or even if it is addressable.  You’d need to look into that yourself, and perhaps start a long journey with therapists of various types.  I suggest that no single type of therapy will be ultimately effective; you’ll want to include body centered therapies along with cognitive therapies, and also explore other options, such as visualizations and hypnotherapy.


Here is an example of one type of problem Cluster A issues lead to:

John Cleese talks about extremism as a manifestation of Cluster A personality disorder. Both paranoid and schizoid are cluster A personality disorders.

Roosh is paranoid schizoid and through both heavy handed banning and overmoderation, plus attracting like minded followers of his thoughts, his remaining commenters skew disproportionately towards cluster A.  This leads to a feedback amplification of paranoia and attachment aversion.

“It’s all OTHER people’s fault we aren’t getting the women we deserve!”


Most men ultimately want a girlfriend as their goal with women, but when learning about how to seduce, come across ideas that they’ll fare better emulating an R selected bad boy, and faking it until they make it, and adopting dark triad traits, and avoiding provider qualities.

There is insight buried deep inside these ideas, however the presentation is too surface, too gonzo and twisted by twisted lives, and those ideas are nearly certain to get in the way of attaining what you want.  These ideas present themselves as meta, but it’s a very tricky shadow in the cave illusion.  Those are highly filtered and feedback-amplified views, not meta in the least.

The core insight of these (very false) ideas is that you need to get the true reference experiences and internalize them of being a dominant leader of the women in your life.

You can’t actually fake that.  As you date, perhaps read pre 2012 Roissy and maybe my comments on it.  It’s unfortunate that the comment section and current articles are no longer worth recommending, as the contemplation part of hearing, contemplaing, and action is quite important.  Commenting can really help you get better with women.  So can blogging.

It’s my expience that dating and having girlfriends, and learning to be dominant and sexy and fun within these long term relationships, leads a man to internalize the so called “confidence” that women are supposed to find attractive.  The more reference experiences you have of women treating you well, and of being able to maintain strong boundaries and arouse the utmost best behaviour out of the women you date, the more your body language will tell women that you are valuable and fun.

So this is completely different than R selected bad boy, although it is high-socio-sexual score body language.  You are in a secret society,  but it’s not of pump and dumpers.

It’s of romantic libertines.  You love women, and have had many, and they nearly always fall head over heels in love with you, and you treat them as best as you know how, learn from them, respect them, and try your best to enjoy life with each other.

Then when you are on a date, this will pour out of you – even when you are silent.  Every thing you say will be congruent with this, not because you learned a routine, but because you lived a real life.

I’ll try to be more detailed in the coming days of how to find and amplify positive reference experiences, if there is interest.  It’s a lot of work to go into detail, and I fear that most readers are far too cluster A or suffer other devlopmental cognitive issues to care.

So I’ll ask my readers to let me know if you are even interested in the comments section.  I know I’m viscious as hell in the comments section, but it’s not that scary in there.

Update: My reply to Jack20

Jack, I had asked you to read my 100 comments on Rollo’s blog before I replied.

And yet now you ask me if I believe that alpha fux and beta bux is are not dynamics that happen.

I’m pretty sure that I spent 10 or maybe 20 comments repeating over and over that the lover dynamic and provider dynamic are real, but that people keep refusing to use the word AND. Alpha fucks and beta bucks AND alpha bucks.

It’s kind of infuriating that people can’t hear that one simple word. I even wrote a post on the fact that people can’t process the word and.

Any alpha can be a provider with no risk or diminismment to his alpha status.

Rollo sees the world from the perspective of a beta bux. That’s his whole world.

He can’t even see that it’s completely inconsequential that some guys get treated like a provider.

So what?

Don’t be a beta provider.

That has NOTHING to do with don’t be a provider.

He keeps referencing a study of women’s ovulatory hormone changes, but ALWAYS neglects to mention that the changes don’t happen when the woman is partnered with a high testosterone man.

Also he NEVER mentions that high sociosexual score men don’t have their testosterone drop over the long term when pair bonded.

Which are perfect examples of how intellectually slimy that guy is.  A better example is simply his writing style; he writes to obfuscate instead of to clarify.

It’s completely irrelevant information that people can be taken for a ride and be treated like shit by their partners; other than as a spur to become an attractive man. It has NOTHING to do with provision.

Just become an attractive man – that’s the first and last job, and being a provider has nothing to do with it. You have to be attractive anyway, provider or not.

If Rollo had any clue about this, he’d be singing the praises of being a dominant lover who appreciates pair bonding, and might make a blog around the theme of “contemplative dominance for the modern man”.

He’s completely stuck inside a world that he himself created, and talks from that world, to people in that world.

That’s totally the wrong tactic.

That world is irrelevant.

Don’t be in that world.

How shaking off the 3 Rs is the first step to becoming attractive enough to get your dick sucked routinely. Second step is to…

The manosphere got off on the wrong foot with Roissy. Roissy taught core beliefs that confidence was the root of all attraction, and that dark triad traits were valuable to emulate.

It then stumbled drunkenly into a very dark alley with Roosh, who has serious Cluster A personality disorders.

Then Rollo came along, and hypnotized people with his pseudo-academic speak, and kept hammering over and over propaganda about alpha fucks and beta bucks until everyone just soaked in it and considered it to be true. Incredibly damaging poison.

All three have some insights into women and man-woman relationship dynamics; especially pre 2012 Roissy/Heartiste. However this has acted as fly bait, luring people into a dangerous trap, rather than feeding them.

The root of my personality and my best writing ever is in this post I made back in 2005: https://www.stickmanbangkok.com/readers-submissions/2005/12/face-guile-and-the-commerce-of-living/

It has at it’s root the Buddhist notion that all suffering stems from our unbridled immature human tendencies towards greed, aggression, and indifference. And that there are deeper more healthy and fulfilling ways to approach and deal with each other, that are based in open and awakened heart and unifying the mind in a cohesive honest whole.

We can be loved and give love.

We can. You can.

Stop listening to bullshit manosphere memes. Life is really pretty common sense. Love and be honest.

Below are comments that I made in the last post and elsewhere.  They are relevant and I believe you can piece the ideas together yourself well enough, saving me the effort of making a coherent blog post.

Blackdragon lives in the US and gives advice about maintaining open long term relationships, and has done so for many years. I don’t share his psychological makeup and so would and could not share some of his dating strategies (for instance I can get very jealous), however from my very long and detailed experience I will say that I judge his blog to be his real truth, and his system works exactly as he says, for him. That’s a stake in the heart of your argument right there.

There are countless millions of men in healthy loving long term relationships in the US.

There are pimps in the US.

There are differences between countries, and some basic human nature similarities.

If you want to change the subject to be about risk versus reward, then I’ll simply point out that every risk you mention can be mitigated.

And if it can’t, why the hell would you not simply MOVE?

Here is a quote about an MGTOW commentor that I found amusing:

You must be happy you live in the U.S. so you can blame alimony. Imagine if you lived in another nation, and had nothing to blame.

By the way, alimony is only an excuse not to get married. But you can’t even get a date, much less get laid. So nice try.

People can be, by nature and nurture, overly risk averse, and make this trait a habit that becomes an excuse to avoid personal development and confrontation.

Sometimes it’s better to risk losing everything, rather than live a shit life that isn’t even worth living at all. Because if things really do go sour after losing at a really bad risk:

There are things worse than death. And a timid life lived in fear of love is one of them.


But I really think it comes down to apples and oranges. The title of this blog post is:”If you respect Rollo Tomassi you have been brainwashed into accepting total loserdome for the rest of your life.” for a reason.

Because he is selling the cohesive world view of an apple, and to be happy and successful at life you need the cohesive world view of an orange.

He does not have the personal lived experience of becoming a highly charismatic man able to continually charm his woman to maintain her respect and devoted passionate lustly love, and his own authority and boundaries. *

It’s a very long arduous road to become such a man.

Only AFTER you are such a man, will you even be able to comprehend that the world could possibly be an orange.

But BEFORE you are such a man, you really really really NEED to KNOW that being an orange is a fucking option.

Rollo says it’s not even an option.

Which is why he is, without use of hyperbole and quite literally, an evil man causing tremendous social harm. Who attracts losers and sells loserdome for financial and social profit.

* (There are videos of Rollo online, and you can judge for yourself by his body language if you think he has lived a life working towards such masculine coherent charisma. I think his facial expressions are sometimes smarmy and effeminate and that he is not taking care of his physique. He does not strike me as a dominant sexy man who a woman would naturally give her best to, year after year. His body and facial language don’t give me the opinion that he values being such a man, or knows how to get from A to B, or even what B is.

I think this is a perfectly fair argument to make, because Rollo once posted a video of an Autralian teen named Cory Worthingon, and we were to judge by his body language and the coherent world view that it expressed (his attitude), using the “I know it when I see it” test, that he was an Alpha. He referenced the video and his argument many times.  He would tell us to watch Cory’s body language, as proof of his argument that “Alpha is not a demographic”.

He later went on to pull a sly and unspoken 180 degree turn and limit alphas to a class of physically attractive men that inspire lust on the spot, and claimed that if lust was not inspired on the spot that the man should look elsewhere on the spot.  An opinion that is a blatant tell of a keyboard jockey; no experienced charismatic man could possibly hold that viewpoint.)


Hi Jack.

I appreciate the careful thought that you have put into your questions.

Please read this and confirm and then I’ll take the time to respond in detail.


It’s about some major disagreements I had with his philosophy in 2014. I stopped commenting after the exchange, and if you make it to the bottom of the post, you’ll see why.

Comment update:

I have a lot of ideas about your questions, however after years of internet discussions have long ago come to realize that very often people are completely fixed in their views, and only use what looks like rationality in order to either confirm their confirmation bias or dissimulate.

That’s why I asked you to put in a little bit of work to test your intellectual sincerity.

However for now I’ll just cut to the chase, and contrast the gist of all your questions, with the gist of my post about how to give and receive love

In order to give and receive love, you need to:

1) Believe that this is possible, attainable, and good, for you personally

I’ve also made many posts that uses the quick shorthand term of “losers” to categorize Rollos commentors and the very closely related MGTOW movement.

I’ll be happy to expand on the argument that those who refuse to give and receive love, and use all sorts of rationalizations and dissimuations to avoid it, are losers.

And I’ll be more than happy to explain in 100 ways why love is essential to basic human well being. And that it’s attainable, sustainable, healthy, noble, and far above risk in reward. And I’d be happy to go into great detail about what love is and can be.

If you are worth talking to. Most people are not.

We are all a product of our reference experiences. Your questions would lead me to believe that if I were to describe my life’s experiences that you would have no option but to discount and re-write them, and to explain them away in ways that make me completely deluded to believe that my personal experience actually happened and is happening.

And I understand the sneering disdain that I not only don’t try to hide, but try to make as obvious as possible. I think it’s good and appropriate. I’ve seen myself get fat and unattractive. I’ve seen myself get drunk and treat people poorly. And I’ve seen myself diet and get fit and learn how to behave better. I’ve seen myself being completely unskilled at relationsips, and I’ve seen myself grow charming and fun and a respected authority in my relationships whom girls routinely sing loving love songs for – for year after year. I’ve seen myself suck at sex, and be great at it. I’ve seen myself lazy, and I’ve seen myself keep trying to get back on the horse.

I have every right to be disgusted by what is disgusting in myself, and to point it out when I see the same in others.

And what’s far far worse than mere personal laziness (everyone has the right to personal ruin and suicide, along with the ridicule that they should expect for following a path to ruin) is TEACHING others to give up. That they SHOULD give up, because relationships – the most noble of all possible endeavors – are low reward at best and more than likely dangerous.

When someone projects out his own inadequacies onto society as a whole, and then sets himself up as an authoritative teacher, that is, in a word, EVIL.

This is a comment that I think fits into the basket of “can’t we all just get along”. It’s a non-comment. A self-entardation meme-hammer.

Polemic is polemic is polemic. Why do you need to soften the edges? Make things all warm and fuzzy, and feel good and everyone gets a gold medal just for participating?

No, some things suck. Some things suck less. Some exact specific things that Rollo says are toxic, some exact attitudes that he has are toxic.

Don’t bring your photoshop smudge brush here and blur everything into a gigantic smear of “it’s all good, man”.

I used to sell wares on Grateful Dead tour, and the dreadlocked hippy wanna-bes tried their best to share a philosophy, that revolved around the saying “It’s all good”.

Fucking idiotic twats. When I could be assed about it, I’d confront them. No, it’s not all good. Fucking dimwit, non-confrontation is not a god damned philosophy!

Fucking hippies. It’s been studied that too much LSD makes people passive and afraid of confrontation. I keep losing the link, but I found the study on erowid.

I don’t suffer fools gladly, and people who think that confrontation is a meltdown have never witnessed a debate with a participant like Christopher Hitchens.

It’s NOT all good. No, we can’t just learn from everyone. People get sucked into entire world views, and YOU KNOW IT.

To get unsucked, you need to be vigorously shaken, sometimes. How hard is it to stop being Catholic, for instance? It’s all good? Just pick and choose the good that the good Pope says, and ignore the rest?

YOU KNOW very well that it doesn’t actually work like that at all.

World views are cohesive, and swallowed cohesively. People create authorities and swallow up everything they say, because they imbue no only specific ideas with validity, but the speaker of the ideas. YOU KNOW THAT.

Rollo’s food is laced with life sucking toxin, and so on the whole, his food is toxic. You can’t pick and choose from Rollo, practically. Because 99 percent of people who read him swallow all the intenesely life harming garbage – as a specific example the HIGHLY toxic meme that alpha fucks and beta bucks.

I’ll drop this here again:

And what’s more, if you want to understand what a book teaches, don’t just read the original text.

Ask readers of the book what it means. Then you’ll get the most important message – not what the book says, but what it is being read to say.

Anyone can paint a picture of a pear, but if everyone sees an apple, then the picture is of an apple.

Want to understand Rollo’s teachings? Examine his comment section. Compare his commenters with other slices of society.

They are for the most part MGTOW losers who have very little clue at how to date successfully, let alone how to maintain long term passionate relationships with attractive women. Which could be a fine starting place, yet nearly to a man they want that to be their ending place.

THAT is what Rollo teaches. The maintenance of class immobility. Alphas are alphas and betas are betas, so it’s not really your fault – it’s womens fault for wanting an alpha. And if you ever do become alpha, you’ll realistically have to pump and dump.

The passive agressive mind-fucker keeps pretending that he’s amoral and agnostic and just describing a real world.


He’s creating a diorama. NOT describing a world. His world is a fucking cartoon with gigantic meter wide pixels and only 4 colors used in the pallate. It’s a diorama that barely resembles life at all. And it’s all due to his lack of real world experience in relationsihps, combined with what experience he has coming from an underdeveloped place, combined with his confirmation bias of only accepting input from betas and losers at the game of relationships.

His view is not agnostic in the least – it’s the view of a loser, to losers, who swallow it up thankfully, as it absolves them of any responsibility or hard work to change their own circumstances.

Days of Broken Arrows Said:

Terrific write-up. I agree with this and upon reading it realize why I never go to his blog anymore. In addition to what you wrote, his writing is also joyless and humorless. His worldview is that having a love life is a backbreaking slog that required work, work, work 24/7 — and you’ll probably still fail because hypergamy.*

Chelsea Dagger said:

I never thought much of Rollo’s writing to be honest. It is very dry and humorless and his followers do seem to be a bunch of angry guys. It reads like a chemistry textbook and is simply too tedious for me to get engaged by it. I think Roosh is just as humorless unfortunately. Whenever I read his blog, you can really see that he is a lost soul, just meandering along with no purpose. Neither of these guys are well adjusted, happy guys and their followers are much the same. Roosh’s forum these days in particular is really attracting some dregs between the white nationalists and the nihilistic hedonists who’s only purpose in life is scoring one night stands.

These joyless, miserable men are guys I quite frankly want nothing to do with.


I like how you made the theme of this blog post about lifestyle and positive habit maintenance-grind as being fundamental to good inner and outer game and logistics.

I’ve also let things fall apart a bit, and am trying to get things in order. So much constant maintanance required to be able to be optimal and ready to give and receive at opportune moments.

Gym and diet
Meditation and chi kung
perhaps Business

as the top three, usually.

Maybe also:
practicing music
keeping up with a tan
staying social
keeping a good home environment, which might include gardening, decorating, cleaning, maintaining audio and video equipment, furniture and bedding and kitchenware and toiletry

Doing what we do in the moment is of course always a product of what we’ve done in the past, and much of what we have to do falls into the category of maintenance.

It’s not like a video game, where you just need to be good while in set.


There have ben some fun critiques over at Krauser’s lately of dodgy commercial PUA trainers.

It comes to mind that trainers that don’t mention the maintenance issues, and over-emphasize game, might have some of the common traits that Krauser laughs at, such as:

* outright lying about their stats
* paying for sex
* fucking ugly girls
* low to zero retention
* sexing drunken girls who are so easy to fuck as to be repellant to most men
* interested in the notch more than the quality of the girl, sex, experience, relationship, and her experiences of you, the sex, and future relationship; notch is the win – like a video game point.

Writers who use the term “well rounded” seem more authentic and trustworthy. It’s just like you say – a well rounded together life is embedded right in the exact present moment you bring. You can’t be actually attractive without being well rounded.

At least not to girls who aren’t crazed and dangerous human rent-a-bikes.

I feel that relationship game is barely discussed on the popular blogs that deal with seduction. I have a long habit of living with much younger women, and at 52 my current live in of 8 months is 21. We get along very well, and she treats me well.

I assume that just like day game, it’s a hard won skill that one continues to learn about and get better at. Of course it’s not just about set, or your internal framework, it’s also about setting, or the girl and her culture and your external setup. It’s still unusual and difficult to arrange big age differences with an attractive young woman who isn’t bonkers, but it’s much easier in some places, such as SEA.

And ya, people vary hugely, and while there may be trends, a lot of guys really aren’t built well for long term monogamy. And open relationships are possible but extremely challenging and volatile. The options for relationships are MUCH vaster than is generally discussed. The possibilities are MUCH bigger than is usually even hinted at.

I assume because it’s an overlapping, but still distinct and separate skill set. You can’t just transition out of day game into relationship game, as if it’s all the same thing.

Update: This is a low traffic blog, but sometimes gets a traffic boost if linked to by higher traffic sites, such as reddit.  If any reader finds the idea I’ve put forth that the meme of alpha fucks and beta bucks by definition could only be true from within the perspective of a “beta bucks” man,  and would always be false to a charismatic man and dangerously limiting to a man who wants to learn to internalize being seen by the woman he’s fucking as a dominant man, it would be helpful to your fellows to start a thread or comment that includes links to these recent posts.  I know that Rollo has snuck in as a cornerstone in peoples ideas of dealing with women, and this is actually a very serious sickness that needs serious discussion, in as many forums as possible.

If you respect Rollo Tomassi you have been brainwashed into accepting total loserdome for the rest of your life.

Rollo says that it’s impossible to be in a loving long term relationship. You can either pump and dump, or be a doormat who is not respected.

Over and over he talks about alpha fucks and beta bucks, and how it’s completely impractical to the point of basic impossibility to be an alpha provider.

Take a look at any of the old MGTOW forums. They are a self selected community of total losers at life, whose only purpose to talk to each other is to make each other feel just a little bit better about their position at the bottom of life’s barrel. The way they feel better is by constantly pointing fingers away from themselves – it’s everyone else who is stupid and doing it wrong. They aren’t the losers – the people who think they can win at relationships or are winning are the red and blue and purple pill losers.

Rollo gathers around him guys who have recently been burned at relationships, and teaches them that it wasn’t their fault at all. He creates an unfalsifiable world view that excludes all possible other views, and gathers together a community that always lets him carve and serve each turkey slice from the head of the table of his king-of-the-losers autobiographical-book club.

Rollo is a midwit who can barely organize his own thoughts, and disguises his disorganization in obscure academic sounding gibberish.

Look at Roosh’s communties. Very similar – very tight knit world views – however theirs is mostly a rigorously moderated echo chamber built around the personality cult of his flawed Cluster A paranoid-and-shizoid personality style.

It’s extremely sick, how a man can talk for years and years about his own life, and pretend that he’s actually talking about relationship dynamics. As if the more believers to his church he can convert the more true will be his god and the less pathetic will be his own life. There will never be a lack of ready and willing true believers – they come from the ranks of the miserable. Church can be rewarding and helpful, if the community focuses on helping each other, and not on an afterlife and preventing current pleasures. Rollo slyly and passive-aggressively focuses on preventing lasting mutual loving relationships. Sicko cult leader, using people who are having a tough time to bolster his social and financial positions, while burying his failures. Twisted fuck.

Rollo knows NOTHING about maintaining strong passionate love affairs, year after year. NOTHING. And he convinces the world that the reason his marriage and love life suck are because women are hypergamous. It’s not about him and his life, it’s about stages of mating, hypergamy, dual mating strategies, and everything else that is out of his ability to control or manipulate.

I wrote this the other day, originally at the bottom of this post:

Just talk about what it feels like to your own cock in your own wife. What’s with all these third person abstractions? You have totally lost track of what it even means to have a self. You are lost in a world of internet abstraction, a world of feedback from losers, where you seem to be king.

Are you king to your wife, when your cock is in her? Or do you need to retreat to your laptop to feel like a king?

Everybody has the right to talk about and interpret their own experiences.

Critics live in abstractions, and distance themselves deliberately, because no one likes pain, and an abstract world might be less painful.

Sure, Rollo.

It’s also anhedonic. Talk about your own fucking life, directly – you ain’t god with some ultimate viewpoint. You only have your own life – that’s it. Put your cock into the first person gonzo story.

Everything that you’ve ever written is not a cultural critique or an analysis of the nature of men and women. Everything that you have ever written is gonzo. You just refused to put yourself into the narrative.

And it’s a story of a guy who learned a bit, and gave up. A guy who thought that higher education was a thing, and that he had it.

You are a guy who refuses to put himself into the gonzo narrative. But every thing sentient puts you into that first person; even every last disinherited part of your loneliest forgotten self. And me; I put you into the gonzo narrative, Rollo Tommasi. It’s you who writes that, and that’s your personal first person lived life, on virtual paper. It’s not third person. Writhe and squirm and dissimulate – everywhere you go, there you are.

Your narrative really sucks, Rollo. It’s the narrative of your own personal life, and it’s not meta in the way you wish it was. Unless you want to identify with people who share your story.

Your story is small and undeveloped. You can have a next chapter. Just do it. Just have a next chapter. Or at least stop depressing everyone with your sad life. Stop telling other people that your life is the story of the limits of all their possible depressing futures. Mr. Meta.

If you want to talk about spreading a realistic message about improving happiness, start by feeling it. Then talk about how it feels, personally, contextually, in taste feeling form sound and current perception. Be there, now, and share that. Meta man.

Keyboard jockying about losers? Without knowing or caring or telling them how to feel and share love?

You are the losers you talk about, Rollo. Every post you make is gonzo, for years and years and years, to everyone else but you. It’s obvious that you are a reporter embedded in your own life, talking about your deeply personal lived experience. It’s always obvious. It’s so clearly about your own marriage.

There are websites that give a readout of the most common words used on web pages. Rollos is what you would think it is. It’s so predictable it’s like an insane robot from a nightmare. Alpha Hypergamy Bucks!


Why should I pretend to be dispassionate, as if we are all just disengaged from watching a distant TV set?

When people comment on forums, are they disengaged?

No, from what I see, people believe and are affected.

Lovers try to be distanced, but men and women both can’t help but be inextricable from their love affairs.

Propoganda is a science and art, and it works. Words hypnotize.

You are reading propoganda on other sites, and on my site.

It’s a real war – it’s a real thing. People are really affected. There is less distance between you and your computer screen than you imagine. This is a meme war, and the end result is overall ability to accept personal happiness and work towards mutual and my own happiness.

You also are a moral relativist.

Great comment Jake. I can see that it just rolled off of your fingers, even though each sentence is deeply soaked in meaning – like Tolkiens writings. It’s not quick plot twists that you can speed read and skim; you could chew on each sentence for as long as you care.

That comes from a contemplated life.

Jakes said:

The inevitability of moral decisions, for all decisions have a moral component. Perhaps that is what moral relativists are running from?

As an example, my relationship with V.

The eternal connundrum. A pretty young sincere virginal woman who wants nothing else but to marry you, and will use every possible means of seduction to get that aim, including at first forgiving other lovers – or even perhaps allowing them.

But in the end it comes down to a conflict of interest. How can we not be empathological and give in to monogamy? Or are we being psychopathic by refusing?

It’s a conflict of interest; there is no moral solution to a conflict of interest.

It’s naive, and I’d say a naivete born from inexperience, that could posit that free will absolves the moral dimension. “just tell her the truth and let her decide”

Doesn’t work. Try it. She will STILL want monogamous marriage, and STILL feel huge pain that will STILL deeply damage her mind and her future.

Exactly as you say; there is no ultimate frame of reference. That’s the inevitable phiolosopy of science. Science itself is embedded in our biology. Our personal frame of reference is inescapable, and there is no ultimate morality – no amount of empathy gets us to an omnicient point of view that is best for everyone.

There is no best for everyone.

And yet to attract women, we need empathy.

And so to love others, while at the same time being honest to our own true nature, we must cause horrible and possibly life damaging hurt.

Moral relativists might want to run from something, but we’re all dragged eventually into the inevitability of moral relativism. It’s the exact place that humans by our nature can not abide. The very place of uncertainty; agnostacism at it’s easiest and lazy-sloppiest, multi-perspectivism once in sharper big picture focus.. Either way, morals lose a single perspective the longer you look at them. This does nothing to dull the pain of causing suffering, or of compromising to suffer oneself.

How to give and receive love with a pretty young woman, habitually.

I’ve been very critical against some manosphere memes and those who spread them.  The reason is because I believe that these memes can directly cause tremendous personal and social harm, by stunting personalities and lives.

It’s my belief that deep down humans are wired to seek out pair bonding and love.

It’s my belief that much relationship advice directly prevents succeeding at these immutable and innate hard wired deep human drives.

The pre 2012 writings of Heartiste directly and openly admitted to the tremendous and inescapable value of love – and how love is the greatest possible pleasure.  Later he de-emphasised this, then seemed to completely forget it, then seemed to completely negate it.  Eventually he kept harping over and over on a clear falsehood – that confidence is the root of all real attraction.  To him all atractive traits can be reduced to and replaced by confidence.  Pure bullshit that will directly prevent you from finding and maintaining loving relationships.

Rollo says that it’s impossible to be in a loving long term relationship.  You can either pump and dump, or be a doormat who is not respected.

Roosh is just schizoid, and all but insane.  He’s deeply anti intimacy, and yet somehow thinks that intimacy could be possible, if only he could find a woman good enough.  Nothing is about him – it’s all about culture and women’s beliefs and habits.  He bans and prevents comments outside of his incredibly narrow and harsh belief system.

I’ve talked in greater detail many times about my disagreements with the philosophies and teachings of these dangerous and harmful men.  Please don’t underestimate their power over your mind, and their ability to personally harm you and your life.

I need to keep getting back to that, over and over, because some habits of mind directly will block your ability to give and receive love.

In order to give and receive love, you need to:

1) Believe that this is possible, attainable, and good, for you personally

2) Believe that you can realistically meet and date and spend a great deal of time with a woman worth of loving

It will be quick and obvious to see that many popular relationship experts can’t accept the most basic fundamental premises required for love, which is REQUIRED for human happiness.

So they are really trying to fuck up your life.

You might notice the next time that you are into a girl, that you are wary of leaning in too far into emotionality, because you’ve been heart broken in the past, and you don’t want to fall into a vulnerable position again.

It’s a wise instinct.  I have to admit it; love and heartbreak are two sides of the same coin.  Usually one leads to the other.

But it’s still worth it.

Which leads us to a 3rd and 4th requirement to be able to give and receive love;

3) Being able to maintain strong interpersonal boundaries (so as not to lose one’s self)

4) Being able to constantly repair ones boundaries and well being, through lifestyle and meditative and body centered meditative disciplines.  You can afford cuts scrapes and bruises if you can heal.  The greater regenerative capacity you grow, the greater your ability to risk injury.  Love requires a strong heart – and a strong heart is both vulnerable-and-sensitive-and-open, and well defined with clear boundaries of acceptable situations to be in and behavious to accept.  And a strong heart heals strongly – it’s our biological and emotional fact of life; life is about constant regeneration.  So is love.

Character and wisdom demonstrably come directly through sorrow, and this has been statistically studied. This blog is too low traffic for it to be worth my time to dig up links, but I’ve posted on it before. I know, there are over 900 blog posts here, so if you want to follow up on that thought, it’s still a matter of your own interest and Google-fu. But we all share that same intuition; who doesn’t prefer the company of wizened battle hardened happy folks?

Rough ideas that I may edit:

  • Love is somewhat dependent on physical lust – in both directions.  You need to both be proud of how she looks, and be into her type physically, and get off just from seeing her, smelling her, contemplating her, and also you need to have a self respect and eroticism.  You need to be proud of how you look, and get off on your own sexual response, and know that she is proud of your physicality and eroticism and how she can get you sexually high.
  • A very quick way to mutually share love is through role play.  We have intrinsic evolved responses that go back millions of years into the history of how our emotional systems work.  These responses are archetypal.  The most basic, fundamental, old, powerful, archetypal emotions relating to love all spring from our most basic, oldest, emotional responses of all – those of parents to children, and of children to parents.
    • You can very quickly fall into workable habits of mutual love, simply by role playing Daddy Daughter.  Girls fall into it near immediately – usually with just the barest of hints that you are into that.  Very occasionally some girls will be reticent about that game, but it’s too deep to really avoid – the intellect evolved much later, and the emotions are stronger and more base – it really doesn’t matter if the intellect disapproves at all.  The intellect might disapprove of a certain man or woman, but you’ll still get wet or hard.  Daddy Daughter goes too deep to be affected by approval or disapproval.
    • Daddy Daughter is also a good archetype to use in general, outside of the bed.  You’ll allow yourself more patience, and personal authority.  She’ll allow herself more abandon and respect.
  • A major issue that I don’t think has been addressed at all, on any relationship forum, is the incredible importance of relationship practice.  People are not innately good at being in relationships.  They fail often not just because women suck.  Sure, compatibility is important, but relationship is a skill – a difficult skill.  At least as difficult as piano.  It takes practice practice practice and you learn more and more and more.  You can’t learn it from a book, you can’t learn it all at once, and you can’t know what it is yet that you need to learn.  No one can tell you.  You only learn piano in steps – only by practice.  Relationship skill is a skill.
  • Daygame skills barely overlap with relationship skills.  You can be the top pickup artist in the world, and still be completely inept at giving and receiving love with an attractive young woman, and maintaining passion day after day for the longer term.  If you are interested in relationships, you need to very clearly see and know this. Getting a girl into bed is barely related to keeping her in passionate obsessive devoted love with you.

Feeling love is similar to feeling joy.  I assume most of us tend to avoid feeling happy, at some deep fundamental level.  We carry around with us like a childs comfort blanket this constant burden of feeling alienated and wanting.

Even in the middle of the most rapturous sex, this bad habit of mind can intrude, making it impossible to really feel loved, and to truly give over to that joyous celebration of mutual lusty devotion.

The easiest way around these neurotic mind habits are through the meditative disciplines.  Perhaps augmented by very rare psychedellic drug use.  Body centered meditations, and especially chi-kung get you into being being, and out of thinking about and watching being.  With body centered being, you can be love – just embody and feel and control and use your emotions, just like you sometimes do when you are totally into some song and riffing along with it in voice.  You join in with that song, and are at your full creative potential in your flow moment, embodying your emotions and body all together without need for separation.

You need to respect your own psychological need to do this, and respect that this is natural and default for women; they love to be in love.  They want and need it, just like naive teenagers.  You don’t need an excessive self regard to feel loveable.  People just like to love; it’s perfectly natural, and you can be a good enough receptacle for that attention.  Especially with care and practice.

* Being with someone is about re-enforcing habits. Habits of your own behaviour and moods and attitudes, and habits of your companion.

I suppose a definition of being charismatic is exactly that; the ability to re-enforce in others a habitual sense of joy for being around you.

I hear people often complain that they could not imagine being happy spending a lot of time with a woman, especially living with one full time, and working from home.

I think it’s not only a matter of personality style. I think it’s also a matter of relationship habits. And of course sexual habits.

I’ve written quite a bit about sex, and it’s my belief that lust is a huge help to maintain interest, and therefore the habits that increase lust, such as not having frequent orgasms if these tire you or lead you to disinterest, and doing chi-kung and lifestyle improvements that increase libido. Who hasn’t heard the joke of losing all feelings of love and interst after having a male orgasm? Male orgasm, because some women can actually get chatty and needy after coming. The reverse is also true; keeping your libido increases your interest in the woman. You’ll learn to prefer having that interest, and so will she. It’s better for the both of you if you are interested in each other.

Along with regular passionate sex, there are many other big and small ways that spending a great deal of time with a companion can become easy and fun.

You need to be able to enforce your quiet time boundaries; usually people simply don’t talk to each other. This is difficult for women, at first. But they get used to it, and it’s completely going to be your job to make that so. You will get annoyed if there is unwanted chatter all the time. Eventually the both of you will learn to appreciate silent company, as if you can feel each other in the space, and like that feeling. A feeling you both feed – a feeling of contentment and humor and appreciation. Maybe you had that with your Grandma as a young child. Being together is not equal to being burdened; we can learn the joys of shared silence. And be fed by the shared silence, and feed into it.
Just as it takes you time to learn, it will take your woman. You are both flawed characters, but at your best you’ll be trying to make each other happy – lately I’ve had girlfriends who do this as habit. Before I’ve had girlfriends who would often do the reverse, and deliberately cause angst. It’s quite common for women to be troublesome deliberately, and difficult to avoid, but it is avoidable. It’s not their fault entirely. Eighty percent is up to your own actions, 20 percent is up to your mate choices; and of course mate choices means being able to attract as well as being able to choose.

Some women are great to go sexually quickly, but others can take one or even two or even more years to slowly grow into their ability.

It’s also quite a bit your own responsibility that this happens. Again, Daddy Daughter is a decent mental framework. Younger guys obviously can’t be in a position to mentor, and so I recommend young guys spend time with older women, who are very appreciative mentors. Some older women do very well in the role of mentor, and have more to teach than you can know; elders always do. Later you can switch up the roles, with younger and younger and younger mates.

Strangely enough, you’ll learn a lot about being an authentic masculine authority in young women’s lives by as a young man dating much older women who mentor you. The dynamic is different in ways, and similar in others. The regalness and mutual respect from different positions remains.

If I drink, I’ll eventually ask you to tell me a story. When I’m out on the town with my 21 year old little girl, sometimes it gets to the point that I ask her to tell me a story. Inevitably she recounts our first date.

It was really that good. I’ve documented it here. It’s etched in her mind, and fresh. Our love is at least as strong as fresh young infatuation. Love can last longer than the average 6 months to max 2 years. In a minority of people the measured blood hormones associated with passionate love remain indefinately.

She still tells me that she loves me many times a day, just like she did from day one. She came this morning many times, and I was quite full of bonded attachment and love for that small child like woman.

It’s a skill.

If you want it.

I had to believe, on that first date, that all that actually did happen between us could happen between us. To me it was simply inevitable and obvious.

I wrote this as a poem once: “Cynycism is the dust on angels eyelashes”. Or something like that. Cynicism is just dust on our eyelashes – it’s not our vision, not our heart or understanding or soul. It’s just dust.

Relationship isn’t a skill in the same way that learning the facts of history is a skill.

You can’t memorize being competent at interpersonal skills.

Can you find a book that will teach musical improvisational skills?

You think there is some guy who can teach you to day game?

No. Well, not quite.

I’ll prove it quickly.

When the Beatles first came on the scene, most all bands that they knew only played cover tunes. Playing cover tunes is a level of competence, sure, but no one gives the same respect to others or ourself for mimicry.

Later they thought they should create their own tunes.

There is a lot of music created by different people, and it’s all quite distinct, even as we usually can recognize what comes from each distinct artist.

When you create music, you’re on your own.

Being good at relationships is like being good at music. It’s going to be your own creation, and it’s going to be extremely different at different times in your life, and with different women.

There is no book about this.

You can’t learn improv, exactly, yet you can learn improv, and it does help to hang around and improv with others. Seeing others do it makes you see that it’s an option, and you might try it, on the spot.

It’s really up to you to forge and discover your way.